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Ak - if you stick cheap retread tyres on a porsche I will wager it will only give "50%" of its full performance. Porsche dont make their own tyres though they provide it in the price (its not free its built in to the costs of course!) as I am sure any hifi dealer would be glad to do. As I said it is trivial to demonstrate the effect of the air support. With the air out the BL is equivalent to something like the origin live resolution, and below the first tier of decks. With the air suspension the deck as it the forefront of the first rank - and I have heard a lot of the best turntables bar the kuzma and some of the US decks.

SM - I believe you warned me earlier in the thread to be skeptical about dealers endorsements - maybe there is a good margin on arcici stands? ;-). The US distributor advises vibraplane or hrs - I suspect the arcici is the dealers preference. It sounds like the same dealer as the guy I spoke to on audiogon. Maybe even the same guy. A quick google revealed
http://www.stereotimes.com/acc041499.shtm which would seem to indicate that perhaps all is not well with these stands.

However you dress it up you dont know what my system sounds like. Have you heard the three way pmc models from the ib1 upwards and with the ST amps (the sst sound sterile to me)? If not then they sound very different to the other models you may have heard. In any case even if you have that still leaves the deck, arm cartridge, phono and pre utterly unknown to your experience so caution is obviously called for in your extrapolations, as not all of a systems performance can be inferred just from the loudspeakers! All loudspeakers have a signature - what would you put forward as being the ultimate in transparency?

No offence is taken of course - I find your manner civil and helpful, if slightly prone to extrapolation using scant evidence ;-). Given your comment to bub I assume he is referring to my own arguments about his system - in his case I have heard all the components in his system though not all at the same time therefore I am well qualified to comment on it.

Anyway ... I beleive this thread has gone somewhat off course. It being concerned with determining the most effective type of active air suspension as I have decided to take that route and wish to get a handle on other peoples experiences. I look forward to receiving some info from Penance next week. I guess the discussion on whether to go for that route at all or suspended or non-suspended might be considered vaguely related or at least not too distracting!

<blockquote data-quote="anon_bb" data-source="post: 625309" data-attributes="member: 2360">Ak - if you stick cheap retread tyres on a porsche I will wager it will only give &quot;50%&quot; of its full performance. Porsche dont make their own tyres though they provide it in the price (its not free its built in to the costs of course!) as I am sure any hifi dealer would be glad to do. As I said it is trivial to demonstrate the effect of the air support. With the air out the BL is equivalent to something like the origin live resolution, and below the first tier of decks. With the air suspension the deck as it the forefront of the first rank - and I have heard a lot of the best turntables bar the kuzma and some of the US decks. SM - I believe you warned me earlier in the thread to be skeptical about dealers endorsements - maybe there is a good margin on arcici stands? ;-). The US distributor advises vibraplane or hrs - I suspect the arcici is the dealers preference. It sounds like the same dealer as the guy I spoke to on audiogon. Maybe even the same guy. A quick google revealed <a href="http://www.stereotimes.com/acc041499.shtm" target="_blank">http://www.stereotimes.com/acc041499.shtm</a> which would seem to indicate that perhaps all is not well with these stands. However you dress it up you dont know what my system sounds like. Have you heard the three way pmc models from the ib1 upwards and with the ST amps (the sst sound sterile to me)? If not then they sound very different to the other models you may have heard. In any case even if you have that still leaves the deck, arm cartridge, phono and pre utterly unknown to your experience so caution is obviously called for in your extrapolations, as not all of a systems performance can be inferred just from the loudspeakers! All loudspeakers have a signature - what would you put forward as being the ultimate in transparency?No offence is taken of course - I find your manner civil and helpful, if slightly prone to extrapolation using scant evidence ;-). Given your comment to bub I assume he is referring to my own arguments about his system - in his case I have heard all the components in his system though not all at the same time therefore I am well qualified to comment on it.Anyway ... I beleive this thread has gone somewhat off course. It being concerned with determining the most effective type of active air suspension as I have decided to take that route and wish to get a handle on other peoples experiences. I look forward to receiving some info from Penance next week. I guess the discussion on whether to go for that route at all or suspended or non-suspended might be considered vaguely related or at least not too distracting!</blockquote>

[QUOTE="anon_bb, post: 625309, member: 2360"] Ak - if you stick cheap retread tyres on a porsche I will wager it will only give "50%" of its full performance. Porsche dont make their own tyres though they provide it in the price (its not free its built in to the costs of course!) as I am sure any hifi dealer would be glad to do. As I said it is trivial to demonstrate the effect of the air support. With the air out the BL is equivalent to something like the origin live resolution, and below the first tier of decks. With the air suspension the deck as it the forefront of the first rank - and I have heard a lot of the best turntables bar the kuzma and some of the US decks. SM - I believe you warned me earlier in the thread to be skeptical about dealers endorsements - maybe there is a good margin on arcici stands? ;-). The US distributor advises vibraplane or hrs - I suspect the arcici is the dealers preference. It sounds like the same dealer as the guy I spoke to on audiogon. Maybe even the same guy. A quick google revealed [URL]http://www.stereotimes.com/acc041499.shtm[/URL] which would seem to indicate that perhaps all is not well with these stands. However you dress it up you dont know what my system sounds like. Have you heard the three way pmc models from the ib1 upwards and with the ST amps (the sst sound sterile to me)? If not then they sound very different to the other models you may have heard. In any case even if you have that still leaves the deck, arm cartridge, phono and pre utterly unknown to your experience so caution is obviously called for in your extrapolations, as not all of a systems performance can be inferred just from the loudspeakers! All loudspeakers have a signature - what would you put forward as being the ultimate in transparency? No offence is taken of course - I find your manner civil and helpful, if slightly prone to extrapolation using scant evidence ;-). Given your comment to bub I assume he is referring to my own arguments about his system - in his case I have heard all the components in his system though not all at the same time therefore I am well qualified to comment on it. Anyway ... I beleive this thread has gone somewhat off course. It being concerned with determining the most effective type of active air suspension as I have decided to take that route and wish to get a handle on other peoples experiences. I look forward to receiving some info from Penance next week. I guess the discussion on whether to go for that route at all or suspended or non-suspended might be considered vaguely related or at least not too distracting! [/QUOTE]

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