Advice on dacs

I want to get into computer audio just in case cd decides to make its final curtain. So i thought a dac with usb asynchronous input and also connection for a cd player too. At the moment i am using a dvd recorder for play back and i really want a dac to give my system a upgrade also.
I listened to a Chord OBD76 the other day which in the shops system had a nice and unforced sound and nice clean bass. It was on the end of a Plinius amp and some very small speakers by Proac. The price for the Chord is close on £4000 so to much for me. So some recommendations on something along these lines but a bit lower in budget. Thanks

 

New DacMagic is a no-brainer I think. It has a USB input, pre-amp built in, and also the option to add wireless bluetooth streaming. Basically it does everything for a small outlay and has top class performance.

I realise it doesn't use the latest and greatest DAC chip inside, but it is only a few years old, and has very good implementation using two chips for lower noise and distortion and one of the best analog output stages I have seen.

http://www.whathifi.com/news/update-cambridge-audio-expands-dac-range-with-wireless-dacmagic-plus



Having said that, if you really want to hear an upgrade why not consider one of my room correction units that functions as a really good DAC? It doesn't have USB input, pre-amp nor wireless, but the benefit of room EQ can be substantial. http://www.behringermods.com/

 

Yes good old DacMagic. Just a little concerned about performance. Will it give that wow factor. I don't want to box swap, so the right choice now so i am happy for the future. Used will be ok i think as no moving parts so not a lot to go wrong.

 

Just saw your foot note. I used a Behringer not modded though for room correction and it did do a great job. I sold it as i just couldn't fathom how to set it up. I did find putting granite slabs under my speakers went a long way to relieving bass boom which my room suffered from.

 

If you go down the computer source route you might be able to do the room correction in that way.

I really wouldn't worry about the quality of the DacMAgic it is superb in every way. The latest from AudioLab might beat it slightly on measured performance but you are splitting hairs at that point.

 

Don't all DAC's sound the same.....?
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As you know, I don't think all DAC's sound the same, but I do think that a lot of them sound very similarly mediocre.

 

Sure, so I said it is measurably different. I doubt any DAC is going to give you a 'wow' factor from sound quality but the functions are good and you can get into computer audio.

 

Lots do sound the same, because they are extremely close in terms of performance.
There are some that don't, and where this is the case you can easily see why because there are obvious flaws in the technical performance.

If you want a cheap but transparent DAC only, the MF V-DAC does the job at £200.
If you want a pre and headphone amp added to the feature list, go for the CA or Audiolab at £300-£500.
If you want a DAC but also want ADC and EQ functionality then try the Audiosmile unit also at £500.

All sound close enough not to worry and the choice should boil down to the additional functions on the various units.

If a competent dac (thats most of them) sounds mediocre the fault lies with the source file. As Simon says, no DAC will give you 'wow factor' simply because performance has now plateaued into the excellent-superb category.

I hold the same views for phono stages. I had to smile recently when someone posted (not here) saying that 'what we really need now is a new Rega phono stage' - and I though, why?
Handful of components, the ability to engineer accurate RIAA has existed for many years and we've had distortion and noise down below that intrinsic to LP replay for decades.
Like DACS, there is no place to go other than constant reinvention.
So lets see some useful things such as adjustable gain and loading on the front panel, and perhaps switchable EQ for vintage record collectors.

The real attention should surely be focused on the areas where we still encounter issues which prevent true fidelity to the recording. TT design (actually the entire analogue front end), room acoustics and loudspeakers are the areas where development is still very much required IMO.

The other big area for development is completely out of our control, namely the provision of high quality music for download or even on vinyl.

 

Of the three you mention, I only have direct experience of the Audiolab. This is a very nice piece of equipment in terms of use and functionality.

However, despite being assured that I would find different, I didn't think its actual performance was anything particularly special.
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With regard to phono-stages, I partly agree and (inevitably) I partly disagree. I've auditioned quite a few phono-stages in the last year and whilst there are clear differences between them, these differences are not as obvious as one may have expected (or as obvious as the sometimes rather florid eulogy of fellow enthusiasts).
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I'm not really a fan of active room correction. I would support the idea of passive correction and careful speaker placement though. In my experience (of quite elaborate active correction systems) they do address some issues (but these could be addressed just as directly as previously mentioned), but in doing so they introduce problems of their own elaborate manufacture.

 

I'd just like to add to this thread that in April of last year I bought a Beresford Caiman which initially sounded very impressive but after six months of use I went back to my direct CD outputs and immediately realised that the straight CD player was in fact better than the Caiman. I therefore wasted quite a bit of money on yet another black box that was totally pointless.

I do see where you are coming from regarding not turning into a 'box swapper'.

 

It is debatable whether there are differences between dacs as i bought on reviews an Audiosector dac and it sounded exactly the same as my cd player and dvd recorder. I sold it on. But if you pay a higher price for one then surely it would have some improvement, perhaps not day or night but subtle changes.

 

Just found this which looks interesting. A dac with gain to power your speakers. Not the latest upsampling but a Wadia though.
http://www.wadia.com/products/amplifiers/151.php

 

Its just a DAC with a class D amp attached isn't it?

 

No good then?

 

I really think your previous experience with a DAC will be repeated if you follow this route. If you are looking for a real upgrade in sound then look elsewhere. If you want added functionality then it's a different matter.

Regarding room correction, I think there is a lot to be said for using ideal placement but in most situations people can't put their listening seat and speakers exactly where needed for evading all main room modes. Even if you can, it is often at the expense of soundstage with the speakers acting as big headphones. Careful but practical speaker placement along with subtle active correction in the low range has yielded best results for me a number of times. So I still think active correction systems have a lot to offer even if they are not a cure-all, and are worth using in dedicated rooms as well as rooms with competing purposes.

As for the Wadia, it can reduce box count and also remove a gain stage or two since most class D amps have an analog input stage that is then converted to a digital signal and fed to a purely digital power stage. I was looking at the TI range of digital amps recently where about 50% of devices don't even accept an analog signal and need a system controller up-front. It is a nice way to reduce box-count. Still, if you are after ultimate performance I think better will likely be had from a good DAC/Pre with a linear amp.

 

I do agree with you on the room correction. Never tried the absorption on walls as i don't want it looking studio like, and i don't think my wife would also appreciate. Digital probably not as good but can be hidden away.

These perhaps would do a good job but are they as good as my Monitor Golds?
http://www.jblpro.com/catalog/General/Product.aspx?PId=28&MId=5

 

I can highly recommend the Beresford Caiman Plus and also with the Gator mod.

As owner of this DAC since earlier this year and recently with the Gator mod, I can whole heartily report that it is quite excellent and with the Gator mod it takes it into a new league all together.

I have it partnered with a Logitech Squeezebox Touch and am more than happy.

Paul.

 

Jimbo Hi ,if you would like to try the M2Tech Young DAC or even the new mini EVO DAC just drop me a line,
KR and Happy New Year.
Keith.