Always wanted a valve amp?

I suggest you read this first.

http://sound.westhost.com/valves/myths.html#s26

 

a horrendous opinionated rant...imo.

 

So counter it. It seems quite reasoned to me if a bit over stated.

IMO the only valve amp I could ever own would be a single ended 300B, and only a good one with good transformers and good valves, so you are looking at a lot of money, AND a lot of money for efficient speakers able to do it justice. BUT even then I would be listening to it and saying "well its not doing this / that, or the other" even if it is doing what it can in a very pleasing manner.

Nothing is perfect, it is all compromise. But you do realise that if the letter of the EU law and safety regs were ever actually upheld and administered there would be no more valve amps as you know them.

 

I enjoyed reading that article and agree with most of it.
In fact it reads a lot like some of my old rants over on PFM - LOL

He does go a bit OTT but note that he doesn't say that valve amps are 'bad' - just that an awful lot are quite poor, with obvious and audible failings in many cases.
That mirrors my findings and I can enjoy a good valve amp. I just don't think they do anything that cannot be done with a SS circuit, and the latter are greener, more reliable, more consistent and potentially a lot better IMO.

 

Hi Richard

Like any 'rant' , it is pages long and uses bad language to emphasize points - which only indicate writer-bias in my experience.

I can't counter the technical points made, because I'm clearly not from an enginering background.

Like any such 'rant' of course there is truth in what he is writing, I can see that.. when one side of an arguement uses technically supportive language to back up it's arguement, it's a great way to befuddle the reader.

I personally have 3 solid state power amps in the house, and 2 valve power amps. The valve power amps get played all the time, the solid state ones very rarely. ... as Richard says ''I used my ears''..

 

I've just bought a pair of 97db/w speakers for £415. They need a bit of restoration - foam surrounds for the bass units plus a tweeter is not working - hopefully just a blown diaphragm.

Assuming I get them fixed in the next 8 weeks I intend bringing them down to the North London Halloween bake-off with my 300b SET's where we can compare them against some solid state amp / speaker combinations.


I'd also like to bring my EMT tt down too, but I'm not sure if I'll have room in the car for it all...

 

Good idea.

If you can determine the output impedance of the 300B amp it would be interesting to compare to a good SS with the speaker cable loop resistance adjusted (via a pair of power resistors) to match.

What are the speakers?

 

Lindsay's is probably the best 300B SET I have heard so this will be good, magic if you can bring the turntable as well.

Worth the entrance fee for this comparison alone.

 

Speakers are Electro Voice Sentry III's.

They were previously used in the Royal National Theatre - who were going to throw them out as part of a refurb until an enthusiast rescued them and then put them on ebay which is where I got them from.

 

Those speakers are a 'must hear' then.

What are the amps?

I think I heard the EMT at Andrew's TT bake last year and liked it a lot.

 

The amps are early model / prototype Concident Frankenstein 300b monoblocks. They cost me £1600 earlier this year (£1000 cost plus £600 in shipping costs and import duty).

These are indeed the ones I took to the small amp bake-off in South London earlier this year that Richard Dunn also attended.

I also took them to TonyL's last month to hear them with his Tannoys and Klipsch Heresey's. Bass was too lean with the Heresy's. Midrange and treble was good though.

Robert, you can expect a couple of changes on the EMT front since you heard my 930st / Denon DL103 last year. I'm getting a better sound from vinyl now.


Anyway the Frankensteins / Sentrys are a £2k amp speaker solution. Let's see how they compare to other amp / speaker combinations...

 

Oooh, just done some googling, they look like fun!

Tony.

 

cooooooool!

where did you pop up from?

Where are they, do you accept visitors through the door?

 

This may interest the techies amoungst you.

http://archives.telex.com/archives/EV/Speakers/EDS/Sentry III Series II EDS.pdf

 

They look as though they'll be fun. Proper speakers!

 

Basil,

Some sense in that article, but what the writer didn't note is that if the speaker was designed with a valve amp in mind it'll likely perform best with a valve amp.

A big, ol' Tannoy, as an example, is expecting to be driven by an amp with a high output impedance -- it doesn't have a loosey-goosey surround on the woofer, unlike many new speakers -- so if you power them with an amp that has a vice-like grip on the diaphragms you get a dry and bass-constipated presentation because the diaphragms are taught by design. Power the same speakers with a valve amp and the dryness and constipation are gone.

Conversely, if you're powering a speaker that's expecting to be tightly electrically clamped by a valve amp, you'll get sloppy, ill-defined bass. Think Saras powered by a SET.

It has nothing to do with magic or immeasurable but easily perceivable musical quality of valve amps. It simple component matching.

Joe

 

Well said Joe.

 

Rob,

I was trained by a Jedi master.

Joe

 

How many speakers are designed for specifically for valve amps today?

And on a side issue, how can you possibly justify the use of valves and remain green?

 

Joe only eats dirt harvested by his own hands in his backyard offsetting all food production costs and walks to work naked eliminating clothing, fuel and the automobile along with with all associated processes.

Tubes are his only source of pleasure other than the occasional hippie chick turned on by his method of carbon offset.