Audiolab AV antics

Hi.

I'm new to this forum and this is my first post so first a bit of boring background about my setup...

I bought a pair of B&W P5's a little while ago from a friendly scottish chap, I already had in mind either Musical Fidelity, Audiolab, Rotel or Arcam amplification but as he had been sussesfully using them with Audiolab gear I was swayed in that direction. I picked up an 8000S - WOW... What an amazing difference... Later got hold of an old (grey) 8000P & biamped them... made a bit of difference (bit more depth) but wasn't stunned (probably as the P, A, and C share similar older circuitry compared to the superior S, Q & M. Also, the P was a v.old serial. Just recently I finally got hold of some 8000M's - WOW (again) these are far superior, effortless dynamics & acuracy and without tainting the original sound.

I mainly use my system for stereo listening, but i'd love to be able to use the M's optionally as part of a 5.1 system.

I'm currently using the 8000S in preamp only mode (bit strange I know). I tryed bi-amping but I think it sounds better just leaving the 8000M's to get on with it on their own.

I was thinking of getting an 8000Q to give me a bit more purity & detail but I figure I would really like a 5.1 preamp.

I've had a look at the AV30r and the AV32r, does anyone own one of these? It would be a good upgrade for me as apart from the preamp, the dac should be a significant upgrade to the Meridian 203. I also have the 8000P lying around that I could use for the rears. I basically don't want to compromise the stereo listening quality but I do want 5.1.

To add confusion, I have 3 optical sources (CD/DVD, PS2, PC) and 2 svideo sources (CD/DVD, PS2) and i'm currently using an optical selector switch.

I could put the output of the selector into the TOS-in on the AV30r, but I want to know if I have to be on a certain s-video source to hear the TOS input or if I can switch the video and leave the audio always comming from the TOS.

Any info on any high quality av preamps would be apreciated, I dont want to use a standard AV reciever - I have a Denon AVR-1802 which is a few leagues down from the Tag stuff I'm mainly after neutrality, acuracy & dynamics.

Tom

 

I wouldn't go mad amp wise on the B&W P5,for what your spending VFM wise you'll notice much greater gains getting some older B&W matrix 803 or 804,the P5 are too thin and bright,I have P6 at home,the Matrix series are far far better speaker and will give you more gains,but I think you've just bought the P5 so won't fancy the idea,but it's worth it.

 

Hi Adam,

Thanks for your reply, I think I partly agree and partly disagree however...

Some comments:

I have heard some of the Matrix series and wouldn't say in my opinion they are nessecarilly far far better - I think it depends on the amplification, after all the mid, bass, and tweeter drivers in the P5 are the same ones used in the matrix series afaik.

I think a lot of people have the opinion that the P5's are thin and not capable of bass, but I think that they just need better amp matching than most, because of their 3.5 ohm impedance dip.

When I plugged the 8000S into them (previously using the Denon reciever) the difference was massive, the bass really packed a punch. CDs like Jill Scott suddenly made the room shake and that scene in Jurassic Park where the T-rex attacks the cars - the sub from the roars made me s**t my pants! it goes under 30hz easy.

I think that the P5's are worth spending some money on as they effectively have a potential subwoofer built in, it just needs to be powered. The speakers themselves produce a high quality sound that benifit from a bit of grip.

Having said all that - I will at one point be upgrading the speakers, but the monobloc and AV problem remain - i'm looking for a long term amp/preamp solution here although speakers may come and go - so im not really just spending money on the preamp just for the P5's, but for all future speakers I may have - may there be many

If I do ever (!) upgrade from the M's, it will definately be with better speakers

Tom

 

email Shrink. He will have found a soulmate. He has tons - almost literally - of AudioLab kit. If you do upgrade from the Ms, keep me in mind. I home demo'd some recently to good effect.

btw, I use my 8000S in powermode, except with the tuner and the cassette deck.

and yes, you could better that dac.

 

Hi, I run an AV32R bp192 in a 5.1 system for movies and music. Amplification is Rotel, speakers are JM Labs Electra with a Rel Stadium sub.

For movies the TAG pre-amp is outstanding. It's leagues ahead of the integrated I've used and heard. It doesn't do bad with music either; it'll certainly give you that neutrality you're looking for. It is possible with the 32 to assign video and audio independantly. There are two optical inputs and three co-ax for digital signals.

AV32R's are coming on the s/h market for as little as £600 for early units. Later models with the better DACs and bypass features are slightly more.

For music you should also have a look at the Roksan Caspian AV processor. It has less features, fewer inputs and no video switching at all (!!) but it's a better music preamp.

Regards

Hex

 

Both of the processors you mentioned would meet your requirements and much future experiments along the way. I have been another happy Tag toys owner for 5 years. Since there was nothing to touch them for music that also do good AV back then for the price traded in my Linn Kairn without any hesitation. Upgraded the AV32R with a more musical bp192 DAC (and DAB module) along the way. Also have a Rotel poweramp as with present loudspeakers in my own living room nothing upto 5 grand appears to sound significantly better to my simple ears. There appear to be many happy people using the Audiolab and many other types of amps along with these processors. What video monitor would you be using?

Some photos of these toys if interested. http://groups.msn.com/WolfgangHomeTheater/shoebox.msnw

 

hey wolfie, there's always the ''edit'' button on the bottom of your posts u know!!!

 

I'd recommend the AV32R-bp192 as well - I would, I've got one! very flexible set up, Hi-fiBitz had them for £900 (MRP £2500 I think!)

Liam.

 

Hi Tom,

I just made my remarks,as I have both speakers at home,being the P6 and the 804 Matrix,even though as you correctly say,they use the same drivers,personally I feel that's where the similarity ends,the driver arangement,implimentation,matrix bracing to me really affect the sound.I found the matrix,more laid back,sweeter treble,more solid image,and natural,whereas the performance range, I find tonally thinner,much brighter and leaner,they do look good,don't get me wrong they're still good speakers,just the matrix range I really like,whatever you chose,and route you take,your going to have a exellent sound,I had Audiolab with B&W CDM1 a few years ago,and it always gave me great satifaction,I'm sure your final discission will be also.

 

Hi,
Ah... I didn't realise you had the 804's as well - you probably are a better judge of how different they sound!
Interesting - I assumed the cabinets and mounts wouldn't make all that much difference, I'll keep my eyes open for 804's. Also, are there any other good speaker upgrade options on the 2nd hand market? the P5's seemed like a good idea as they are unsung heros - many people are unaware of them and they go reasonably cheaply 2nd hand.

If i could ask for anything, it would be a better soundstage.
Has anyone heard a pair of Epos m22?

That said, i still want the av preamp first because i have absolutely no surround at the moment and i can upgrade the main speakers anytime.

Someone mentioned they had an av32r and you can switch audio and video seperately, do you know if the av30r is capable of this?

Yep, i'm afraid i'm always full of questions

Kind regards,
Tom

 

I believe the AV30R has the same video assigning options as the AV32Rs, but the AV32Rs are much better sonically (especially the bp192 versions) and for very little more money (From about £650 second hand on ebay) and they can be upgraded (IAG not withstanding!)

Liam.

 

hey dude... its meeeee.. the guy who sold you the P5's

how you enjoying them?

id say an 8000Q would be a very good idea indeed given what you currently have

its what i used... and its got better bass depth.. more musicality and better clarity than the 8000S used as a pre. and then you could either keep the S and use it as a power amp for the treble... or sell it in favour of a newer 8000P or PX

get in touch with me on [email protected] if you wanna ask anything.

im probably the best person to help answer your B&W P5 and audiolab related questions.. and also any about home cinema as thats how i used the P5's

 

p.s. old epos ES22... far prettier and better sounding than the M22

i should know.. i got them after the P5's and loved the sound so much i got the next model up too.

ditton will no doubt tell you how great epos and audiolab sound.