CD rethink time?

There is some good advice here, but don't throw money at system till you have located the area that needs help.

How about borrowing a good cdp, or getting a zerogainer to bring one over ? Something that would be at odds with the cyrus.

But I've a hunch you like the looks of the gear you have and liked the demoroom sound too. So that leaves the room and the cables ...

Is your room sparsely furnished ie laminate floors and minimal clutter ? Those first reflections can be a system killer.

 

Laminate flooring? Check!
Sparse furniture? Check!
Patio doors and large glass fronted picture frames? Check!

I have put down installed heavy rugs and floor length curtains, and the sofas and books help too - it was even worse before the furniture went in.

 

Doing something about that will make far more difference than changing cables (which all sound basically the same anyway, unless they're of deliberately wrong design) or CD players (which generally exhibit fairly small tonal variation). Your speakers are probably a prime culprit too. IME MA have quite a bright and forward balance, typical of many modern hifi speakers, and in a room with issues they're likely to give the sound you're describing. I'd look at damping the room a bit more, and if that doesn't cure the problem start auditioning different speakers.

-- Ian

 

it seems that you have a system, cabling and room which on their own and in combination all produce the unwanted symptoms you report. This is good in that we can confirm our 'knowledge' and can make 'good recommendations'. I intend no irony here.

So, what to do.

No doubt that you could 'soften' the room, and that will have greatest overall effect but maybe not to your liking. And if you dont like carpets, cushions, books, etc then that's awkward. But that is where I would start.

Next, I did find the speaker cables you are using to be bright and thin. I have no experience of the speakers - but others do - and do agree that speakers have big(gest) effect on overall sound.

Also, I did not like the Cyrus sound, which when heard in demo room did sound on the bright,hifi side with the mainly accoustic material I listen to.

All that said, I note that you want analytical, ie detail - and for me that starts at the CDP, especially the dac, which happens to be where i put my biggest wadge first and, on advice, invested in a Dax Decade and have never regretted it.

But if the room tweaks and the cabling switches work, stop and then enjoy what you've got. If not, you start all over again :-(

 

Realistically, I've damped the room as much is as is domestically acceptable. Initially we had no curtains! 3 cases of books and a big rack of records also made an impact - as did a couple of heavy wool rugs. Stage 1 is definitely cables/interconnects, then I will need to think about the cd/amp combination. It did occur to me that if both are bright, then changing the amp (valves possibly?) may further improve things on the vinyl side too..

 

I think we may have missed a trick here. di you like the sound of the vinyl replay before you started changing the room? do you like it now? did/does it sound bright and thin?

adding a (warm, cuddly) valve amp may loose the detail you otherwise look for.

 

The Gyro was added after the room was changed - all of this kit purchasing followed (i.e. was bankrolled by) a recent house move. With vinyl, the treble is a little hard and the bass a little light (vast improvement on CD though - and I'm not expecting bass miracles from boxes that smal), but overall instruments sound very 'real'. Soundstage is excellent, speakers almost vanish, image depth is good - well, you know what I mean.

Remember I can flog up to 3 of my Cyrus boxes (C8/PSX-R/Smartpower) to finance any amp change (+ a C5 and a Meridian 203 which are just sitting on a shelf) - but this time, I have to get it 'right' (or 'domestic tension' may arise).

 

That's the problem with buying blind or on recommendation; I might say 'the XYZ CD player is brilliant and just what you need' but to your ears, with your speakers and in your room, it may be no better, or even worse, than what you're currently using.

As a compromise, some dealers offer a 14-day trial period. One I know of is Shadow Audio; http://www.shadowaudio.co.uk/
who also do part-exchange. One of the CD brands they stock is Audio Analogue, which are reputed to have a 'warm' tonal balance.

But I suspect, from personal experience, that the speakers are the main problem.

 

try sticking the meridian 203 in the middle

 

Agree with Joe. I have listened to both the Cyrus CD8 with PSX-R and the Monitor Audio speakers.

I would not have said the Cyrus was the main culprit here but most likely the speakers. My personal preference is for cloth dome tweeters as they seem to be more easy on the ear, especially with CD. When I bought my system, I settled on the speakers first as they seem to vary more in sound presentation than front end components. Having selected your speakers, the only way to select other components with certainty is to hear them with the speakers and amplifier. Perhaps you will need one or more hi-fi listening trips to settle on something you can live with. Although it is preferable to hear a system in your own room, I have not heard any gear that sounded worse at home than it did in the shop demo.

Best of luck.

 

Have you checked the tracking weight on the TT. This could go towards explaining the hard treble and light bass.

Rod

 

My first port of call would be the speakers. Metal domes tend to sound very bright to these ears at least. There are exceptions but MA isn't one. I'm thinking Sonus Faber whatever the bookshelf ones are called or something similair. Anything with a nice soft dome tweeter, so not B+W. Cyrus and metal tweeters is a famous no-no.
Audio Analogue would be a good shout instead of the Cyrus, or perhaps something valved. The new Melody has just got a cracking review and is available at 750 euros. Looks good too.
Worry about your cabling last, it won't make as much difference as boxes, but when you do consider some of Zanash's they're phenomenal value for money.

 

Lordsummit's right - MA speakers sound rough to me. Never liked any pair I've heard. I'd consider getting them changed for something with smoother treble.

I think a pair of Pro-Ac Tablette Reference 8 Signature or PMC DB1+ would be perfect. Both are very extensively developed standmounts that are capable of producing serious bass for their size (the PMC in particular).

Whilst I'm no fan of transistor amps, I think the most pressing need in your system is a change of speakers. Never, ever understood why people like MA so much. What Hi-Fi? herd-like behaviour perhaps?

DT

 

A different approach

I think I've solved your problem, your CD player is excellent and should be more enjoyable.
My bet is that it's the actual CD's you are listening to. Most new cds are remastered which equals ruined, CDs are more compressed than ever,suffer from "smiley eq" and have noise reduction.

Whilst I'm mainly a vinyl fan, CD done right is superb. Try playing some CD's released before 1995 to see if it still sounds bad.

Try a CD from someone like Naim, Audio Fidelity,Mobile Fidelity or ECM. Then make a decision.

the sound of LPs has improved, whilst the sound of CDs is getting worse, whilst the hardware actually gets better.

 

the clear exception to this is the re-mastering of some CDs, which imho are a lot better than the original transfers.

 

Except for the Stones reissues. I cannot think of one remastered CD that sounds better than the earlier "flat transfer"

So I don't really agree - any examples?

 

Even if that's so, and personally I think it's an over-statement, surely the OP's entire CD collection can't suddenly have got worse? As I've upgraded CDPs I've found more and more 'listenable' discs and fewer 'nightmare' ones. That applies to older CDs, new CDs and re-mastered CDs. What you say might be true of chart type stuff, but certainly isn't true of classical CDs.

 

Probably true as I know zilch about Classical, but in the past ten years the use of noise reduction and remastered cds compressed to f*ck to make them sound louder on the radio and therefore "better" means that CD's now sound worse than ever.

Just compare the dynamic range of the old one to the new one. And if you still don't believe me look at the prices paid on Ebay for DCC/Target/West German/First pressing CD's - these are all commanding high prices due to better sound.

 

If all your CDs sound worse than they used to, your system's fairly fundamentally broken.

-- Ian

 

not sure if your'e being sarccy or just not read my posting.

It's NEW REMASTERED CDs that sound so bad, I've never said that CD's change sound.

Why do you think MOFI/DCC/Mastersound CD's command such high prices? it's not just the pretty gold colour.

I'll give you an example, compare any Kinks remaster to the original PRT pressings, compare the dynamic range. It's a no-brainer.
Do the same with Bowie and the earlier Ryko pressings.
Do the same with the XTC remasters and earlier pressing.
I've done many ab comparisons and 90% of the time people don't like the new remaster. That's one of the reasons he's going off CDs.
Don't let your brain be fooled that louder is better.