Decca cartridges - heaven or hell?

Apologies for another needle thread but I'm after as much info, from other folks' valuable experience, as possible seeing as getting a dem on a cartridge is nigh on impossible.

I've tried to draw up a shortlist of cartridge 'possibles' to replace my venerable, but aging, AT. Someone (not on this board) has suggested taking a look at the Deccas - I remember hearing a system with one at a show a few years ago and was knocked out at its speed and vitality.

Very few hi-fi components seem to draw such a divided opinion as the Deccas which is why, in some ways, I find them so fascinating. Will it turn my precious lp's into swarf or will it be manna from heaven??

Bit like riding BMW motorcycles - some folk can't understand why people do but I love 'em, warts and all.

Shortlist is as follows:

Ortofon Kontra B or C
MC15 Super
Decca London
Music Maker
Sumiko BPS
Dynavector DV20XXL (but a tad concerned this'll be a bit soft-sounding).

Thanks, as always, for your opinions.

 

I would go for a cheapo to start, say the mc15. I like it. If you get itchy, you can always go for a dearer one. If you do it the other way, and find the cheaper are no worse you have spent unwisely.
the bps is nice but softish.
If you like vitality, you will love the mc15.
dv10 IMO was not up to the ortofon.dunno about dv20 they have VERY fragile styli, dv, so care.

 

Hi I have the Dynavector on a PT Too / Kuzma. I agree that getting demos is a nightmare. I trust Les at Walrus and he said that for my T/T - which he supplied to me and knows well - that the Dynavector was his best recommendation for a musical and punchy cartridge up to £500.

Also I used to be very friendly with Alan Willis R.I.P. of IAS fame and his demo T/T was a Rock with a Decca London Cartridge that was filled with ferrofluid - he also used ferrofluid in his tweeters but this was 20 years ago way before anyone else was doing it. He thought that the Deccas were a great compliment to the Rock. Hope that this helps.

KJ used to (still might do) recommend the BPS that I was considering to go with a Gyro but I prefered the PT Too / Kuzma combo.

my advice is to see who has a combo similar to yours - so difficult to judge in isolation.

dominic

 

Hi,

I too remember the Decca cartridge in a Rock turntable. Max Townshend used to use them quite often in his dems. He used the Decca Super Gold. At their best, they were very dynamic & exciting sounding. They had their fans. Their strengths are hard to beat.

The Decca cartridges were designed for mono records. They were uprated to handle stereo. They did suffer from poor tracking & damping which lead to certain records getting damaged. But there was a range of Deccas which the better ones had better tips & different compliances. Also they seem to responed to arm damping.

The ones I have heard didn't suffer from bad tracking or give bad record wear.

I would try & have a listen. You could try & have a word with Walrus systems about this cartridge. They sell them plus they also sell the Gyrodek & do the Rega/Michell arm. Try here for details.

Of the other cartridges you have listed, I would go for the Ortofon Kontrapunkt B as the best allrounder. This offers very good & consistant performances. To really beat it you need to be looking at £1000+ options. This is a cartridge that you should be able to get for a home dem. It was mentioned in the other thread, that they can be bought for a bigger saving abroad making them excellent value for money. I have not heard the Kontrapunt C or H which are also meant to be good sounding. I recently heard a Kontrapunt B in a Orbed Gyrodek with the Michell arm & a Dino phono stage. This was up against a Linn LP12 cirrcus, lingo, Ekos, Arkiv. The gyro combo had more detail & resolution & better consistancy to the sound. I enjoyed it more.

With any moving coil, you need a good turntable, good arm and good set up to get the best out of them. Add to this a quality phono stage & you should be able to hear the differences.

The MC15 Super is a good cheap moving coil. You should get a good performance from your system with it. I have heard the Music maker in passing. The system it played in sounded alright. I'm a fan of Ortofons, having had many over the years. My faves have been the Rohmann & my current squeeze, the Jubilee.



SCIDB

 

Thanks guys - much food for thought.

I'll pop into Walrus next week and have a chat with Pete

 

Don't know if you know Pete, but Les knows his stuff better. Dominic

 

Thanks for the tip Dominic,

I've only ever really spoken with Pete - I'll grab Les next time then.

 

If you get a good Decca they can be incredible. High mass arms and or some kind of dampening helps. These things create a lot of energy. I had quite a few with my Rock and Zeta arm.

I never had a problem with tracking or high wear rates.

 

Are you reffering to the rel thread and the needle between Dat19 and Bub

 

A thumbs up for the Dynavector 20 from me - it was between that and the Clearaudio Aurum Beta S for me... Both were fast and detailed enough to rival a Clearaudio Victory at much less wedge..
I went for the Aurum Beta in the end because it has a stylus guard and I thought it would be safer than the Dyn. I've destroyed 2 so far, one because the guard is an absolute bugger to attach! Still, at £295 it's a very good option with replaceable stylus - better than a Sumiko BPS imho with plenty high enough output to power any phono stage, wot with being an MM.
And you know that BMWs are only for sensible Moto Guzz wannabes

 

One obvious make not in the list is denons excellent mc's like the 304 and 103.

 

I heard and liked the Aurum Beta S aswell. A great choice for a moving magnet. If I had one myself, I wouldnt feel desire to change, its as good as many moving coils.

A great MC (probably better than a Kontrapunkt really) is the Benz Glider II. I heard it A/B against the Aurum Beta and it is better, but its around 600 so you'd expect so. Its open design (like a BPS) so you have to be careful with it, but its very good.


Chris

 

the sumiko bps is the metaphorical gsxr750! only the brave need apply.

happy listening.

 

Well...I tried a Guzz once, but I think I got over it...well...I think I did. Certainly an itch that may get scratched again some time. The right number of cylinders, and cooled by God's air so it's gotta be ok

Data - I see there's a 103 on eBay at the moment...thought I might fancy my chances.

 

I have seen it too, nice cartridge

 

You should try a Daytona... Goes like a Buell, but with a more coherant engine noise and a knowledge that it will get you home..
Or if you can stand the upside down canoe look, try out a V10 Centauro - same engine (tuneable for 148bhp!) with no plastic, and they're cheap!

 

'tis indeed.

Just spent half an hour fitting it and doing the lining-up. VTA is about the same as the OC9 so no fiddling with the arm (thank God).

Just listening to some Tom Scott at the moment - first impressions?

Not as clean as the AT which has an almost uncanny 'blackness' in the silence between sounds. Not as detailed either, which is what I'd have expected to be honest (there's a big price difference).

However, it really motors along with bags of life and vitality. It's definitely got the spherical stylus sound - big and beefy but great on vocal tone with plenty of body. All in all a really fun cartridge and one, for the money, that represents a somewhat well-kept secret.

Thanks Data - a nice package.

 

Glad you like it, I couldn't see the point of a rohmann, better, poss., but worth it? no.

I have a dl304 with 20 hrs on the clock, similar, better, yes, prob a match for any. soon to be ebayed.

 

Ugh!!! Could well be tempted!!

Here it is - looking very happy in its new home