Favourate tweeks of all time.

That's great David.

What steps have you gone to to verify your experiments and have to compared results with those obtained in other areas such as acoustic treatments?

 

SM,

I do this purely for my own enjoyent +satisfcation. If i went to the extent of verifying stuff ....there wouldn't be time.

I agree you totally, in an ideal world htis would be the case(verification). I know my music collection well enough to know when I am hearing stuff anew that I've never heared before.

AS far as acoustic treatments my room IS treated acoustically, albeit inevitably with £ cost saving in mind.

That was (partly)what got me into vibration control....cones +ball bearings....it as within my limited budget to experiment with.

 

I'm orff - as HRH allegedly said recently, wide mouthed argumentative, rude opinionated frogs with much time on their hands rule.

Thanks for the help and support given by a number of members and I'm glad to have been of service with what little help and advice I have given here and there (based on a pair of ears and over 40 years of enjoying the hobby). Goodbye forum.

 

Previously from Stereo mik: People spend hours fishing and I personally don't see the point,

Its to catch fish. Thought everyone knew that.

 

Dont go your one of the sane ones on here. We need people like you to help others. We dont want these bureaucratic know it alls spoilling it for everyone who prefer to dismiss peoples views and dont contribute to the help of the forum. Jim.

 

Himmel! Is it always like this? jeez.
If what was so violently opined was credible and based on science not pseudo science it wouldn't be so bad but to read posts that full of dogma and ego is just so boring-I didn't realise romy the cat wasn't a one off-I'll get me coat;-)
F

 

OK let's lay down some guidelines so the "audio morons" as Romy so kindly puts it, understand why it is sometimes neccessary to correct them and in the process stir up their testosterone.

I will question any post that has no basis in reality. That is my right. Audio replay is a scientific persuit first and foremost. If someone posts that a ball bearing mounted on a ceramic saucer improves their CD player, I want them to discuss why this may be the case. If they go onto say that this method of "isolation" improves cd players I want the scientific reasoning behind the discovery and some evidence to back this up. Again this is I feel totally reasonable as the suggestion is that they have discovered something for which no objective data exists to back up their assertion.

You should not feel threatened or insulted by being questioned. If you are sure of your "discovery" you will respond in an educated manner laying out a plausible case. If you are shown to be wrong - so what. Admit it and learn from it. That's how most of us grow up. If you don't understand the qustions being asked, I can assure you they are pertinent to the subject matter, and if you fail to grasp the significance you should not be posting about something you don't understand in the first place - you should be asking questions not fielding them.

I'm too bored with reading unsupportable rubbish to be subtle or matey about this. If I am insulting there is a reason. It is usually that someone has posted in an authoratative manner about a subject they clearly have little understanding of. Why try to look big? Why not use the internet to learn? That's what I have done over the past decade.I have learnt a lot from others and continue to do so every day. I would have learnt even more, and more quickly if I had not had to filter out the posts of idiots in order to get to the real information posted by genuine experts in the field. This is a problem for most internet forae - the hot air ratio is usually high. On ZG lately it has been incredibly high - leading to very few people with any knowledge bothering to visit anymore. This is a downward spiral. The only way to restore some semblance of relevence is to correct. This clearly puts noses out of joint. I'm too old to care about that. I do care about ZG being both a source of information, and a vibrant community with a purpose. It has been before and it can be again.

None of you like change - especially when it comes from someone like me - who really can't be arsed to pretty the message up. The internet as a medium suffers terribly from the lack of visual clues as a communication tool and diffusion aid.

Finally, anyone posting how a length of cable tranformed their system from being unlistenable into a real musical communicator will get insulted instead of questioned, and they will fully deserve it for being such as twat. Anyone who believes cables and tweaks can have that profound impact on replay insults both my intelligence and that of the global scientific community. So they deserve everything they get.

So without pleasantries hopefully that clarifies why I take the stance I do and will continue to do. Once again. If instead of taking umbrage you take knowledge, or the opportunity for intelligent debate, then pretty much all of the problems that seem to exist will disappear. Some won't cope but they've been banned from here before and frankly it was no great loss to ZG.

 

Hear Hear

 

"If I am insulting there is a reason"

Yes, I do beleive you are SM.

I got as far as that in your passage and I ahve no desire to read further.

As far as I am concerned end of discussion, mate.

 

Rather proves the point David I'm afraid.

 

When threads on one of the few forums I have a lot of time for - since the "groovehandle" days - deteriorate I worry. I feel that there is often a lack of respect for others views, whether these have been 'scientifically validated' or not - which borders on the ill-considered. If someone genuinely hears a difference (for the better) and would like to share this then I'm interested. I don't need to demand explanations (I can have a go at working it out myself, I'm not stupid) or challenge just for the sake of it. I subscribe to some 'scientific' based audio discussions - crooked path mailing list being a good example - where like minded "analytical" audiophiles can discuss issues in depth in an objective manner but also appreciate the subjective viewpoint. SM - I hope you don't mind if I mention you saying <p>
"Finally, anyone posting how a length of cable tranformed their system from being unlistenable into a real musical communicator will get insulted instead of questioned, and they will fully deserve it for being such as twat. Anyone who believes cables and tweaks can have that profound impact on replay insults both my intelligence and that of the global scientific community. So they deserve everything they get."
as - as I posted on an earlier ZG cable discussion I was persuaded to change my views on cabling by a friend. He asked me to bring over my cables ( my own copper interconnects, I think mogami studio speaker cable, and a few "kettle leads" as he called my mains cables. ) and listen in his system - early '90s, AVI CD player, LP 12 deck, burmeister amps and some expensive (relatively!) Jamo Concert floorstanders - after a couple of hours listening we swapped to his RA cables (powercords, Kcag interconnects and select speaker cable)- with the system "kimbered up" there was an almost night and day difference to me. Not fully explainable but convincing...

 

I agree with just about everything in that post Mike, except I'd take issue with the need or desire to insult.

I feel as strongly about many of the issues mentioned in your post - there is far too much unsubstantiated crap posted, but if you are going to put up an effective challenge you need to occasionally bite you tongue in order not to be evicted from the party, where you're influence vanishes.

I'm all for slapping down idiots but you need to avoid starting WW3 or getting muzzled in the process. Only the idiots benefit from that.

 

Are you refering to me there, Rob?

 

No.

I haven't sampled enough of your posts to make that call

 

This is a two way street tolerance for those that claim to hear a difference and tolerance for those that cant or don't believe it.

 

Rob,

If I personally insult someone for no reason sure I should be banned. Anyone doing that should be. If however some one gets offended by my candidness in discussing or highlighting the truth, then that's very different I feel.

Take a look through many threads and you will see that it's the ones without an argument who resort to name calling. Unfortunately over here, name calling seems to have been tolerated an awful lot. I deliberately step away these days - look at this weekend's threads and you will see nothing from me - Ian and I were listening to Mingus and Miles and letting these guys amuse themselves. One should just report name calling and let the mods do their jobs.

We've had this discussion before. If I have broken the AUP then I'm guilty of acting against a forum's interests. I very rarely breach the AUP. Thinking about it, could AUP have something about not posting drivel and wasting the host's bandwidth?

I lived over 30 years without internet forums so I suspect I could cope if suddenly I was excluded. Indeed many of us from previous forum lives email each other these days which seems to allow us to discuss interesting audio subjects without idiots starting baseless arguements.

One thing you learn is with the increased popularity of the internet, cyberspace is of such a size that there will always be someone out there who will disagree with you, regardless of your point of view.

 

VF - agreed. My concern would be applicable in both instances.

 

David,

you sadly are merely confirming everything that I have said. Why should he be referring to you? Have I suggested you are an idiot? No. You have contested that you are hearing increased resolution and detail and I asked you why and if you had taken any measurements. For that I am an arrogant arsehole who thinks you are an idiot? Come on!

I'm sure you are aware that just because you suddenly hear a wacka wacka guitar line in a favourite Temptations track, it does not neccessarily follow that you have increased resolution. There always remains the question "should I be hearing that so clearly in the mix?" and tests will prove whether you should or not.

If you were to claim that your experiments with different supports had predicable results in others systems, without anything whatsovever to back that up, would you not think it was understandable that people might question your reasoning?

 

Well, I am glad of THAT.

 

Ah, but Romy is a one-off. in that while totally insane , at least some of the things he does are actually quite interesting.

I remember back in the day when Stereo Mic was famous for his collection of huge Elephant Cock cables (and who knows what else). You live and learn, as they say.

BTW Did I mention that Romy is totally insane - and not in a Kalifornia SK8R kinda way, either. I like the guy