Good secondhand speakers for £6-700... suggestions?

Well, it's not clear that he needs a full range speaker given that he's prepared to use a sub.

Some how I think he'll end up with SCM12's...

 

You could move all the way up to 300's if you really need external amps

But why do you feel the need to have the amps external? Please don't say microphony...

 

I think Paul is smart enough to pick his own battles and he doesn't need you to tell him what to do.

Let me see: Mackie 824, street price in the US $660/each; so it wouldn't be unreasonable to find a used/demo pair in the UK for (pounds) 700. Maybe dunkyboy could flog his Classe to make up the difference?

Frequency response 39Hz-20Khz, peak output 120dB @1m - so I don't think range and volume will be a problem.. Oh, and the measured frequency response looks ruler flat..

Enlighten me oh Merlin, what speakers are you using and which phase of Mana do you worship them on..

 

Guess what Datty boy, Merl, don't need angle iron to get leading edge, sorry (bleeding edge for all mana users), some of us have leading edge that only ferrite whorshipers dream of, whilst have solid note body retention Wm

 

i smell troll

 

Dat19,

Careful, or Merlin might unleash the full power of his subs and cause half the country to fall into the sea

 

Fight, fight, fight, fight! :JPS:

Seriously, though, I have considered Genelecs and Mackies, the only problem is getting a demo...... If I could find a pair secondhand for a decent price, I might give 'em a go, otherwise seems a bit unlikely.

I've been playing with the JM Labs some more yesterda, and got them to sound really good. Then the Classé arrived this morning and I'm having a bit of a dilemma: the Classé sounds phenomenal - lovely tight, deep, controlled bass, great resolution and detail retrieval, lovely solid soundstage, but it seems to have given the JM Labs a tendency towards brightness... sigh... I forgot how difficult/annoying this whole hifi thang could be...

Dunc

P.S. - Definitely appreciate the recommendations for Spendor and Harbeth - I've heard all about these legendary brands and their BBC monitor heritage, and have been dying to listen to some for years. Maybe I'll get a chance at the Hifi Show....
P.P.S. - I would kill to get my hands on a pair of ATC Active 50s (or passive 50s, even), but the cheapest I've seen them go for is 'round about £3K..... maybe some day.....

 

Which Classé unit are you talking about?

 

Can't you just pop into your nearest Spendor dealers and ask to borrow a pair of SP2/3E's?

Matt.

 

I don't like Mosfet amps, and having briefly consulted an ATC circuit diagram I don't really like their amps.

Not really any good reason, just prejudice. And I thought I heard the Mosfet signature from some. But probably not.

Subs are obviously either for stunts or for those who want something for nothing in terms of speaker sizes. It solves a whole bunch of problems just to have full range speakers.

Paul

 

Sadly Paul, it also creates a number at the same time, so both approaches have compromises.

 

Tony, I believe you can get something for that at the chemists.

 

Titian, it's the CA-100. I've been doing some extensive experimentation today, and my initial findings have been confirmed - the quality is phenomenal, but the brightness is unnatural, annoying and fatiguing over time. I compared it to the Arcam Alpha 10P the dealer lent me, and although the Arcam sounds flat and somewhat ham-fisted by comparison (the Classé is especially good with bass), its balance is much more natural and listenable than the Classé's. Not sure where to go from here... Think I'll have to go back to the dealer and see if I can do some amp-swapping (something I'd hoped I wouldn't have to do....sigh...)

Matt, home demos usually require a full deposit - something I can't afford... And seeing as I'd want to buy secondhand, it would be a bit harsh to make use of a dealer's services with the intention of buying elsewhere.

Dunc

 

Duncan,

Dont get rid of the amp just yet! Are you using any power condtioning? with a decent mains lead (possibly on the CDP too) or a Trichord power conditioner, you may well get rid of the hardness and keep all of the other things you like about the Classe

 

Dunc, I have to concur with Robbo here as well, also maybe the ATC pre, is giving the classe' as it fully is?, what I/C's are you using, equipment isolation, I found Classe stuff usualy Ok, never had a 'Bright' problem with at all, if anything a little too 'over natural' and a touch false, but good though
Speakers though, tuffy the atc are just bloody good studio monitors, as for active 20's give mind blowing slam, hummmmmmm .
Problem is, speakers are VERY personal, and the only way is to audition at home in your room with your kit.
Tis a long drawn out process, It took 6 months to find an amp that suited what I was after, and near 12 months for the speakers Wm

Mike suggested.......

Tony, I believe you can get something for that at the chemists.

I made that trip this very morning, and the pharmacist , felt that mana-erised bleeding edge was The best method of 'Non invasive ear wax removal' EVER, and has been doing a roaring trade for months, since I last dropped in and mentioned it

 

Tony, try out the Big Mackie at home and you will be screaming for some angle iron just to tone things down a little

Can someone explain to me exactly how this is meant to impress me? It seems to confirm the old adage that a little knowledge can be dangerous in the wrong hands.

Few studio monitors make good domestic loudspeakers IMO. There are very important differences. One is designed for analysing recordings, one for enjoying music. One is designed for work, one for pleasure. There are a few studio monitors that manage some kind of crossover. Some ATC's (100,150), TAD, Harbeth and Tannoy come to mind. Mickie, MK and Genelec do not. OK for AV but then you hardly need anything great for that, just big dynamic range and slammin' bass. All the more fun if it takes your ears off whilst it's at it!

 

Hmm, I had considered the "support" (or lack thereof) of the amp... It's too wide to fit in my hifi rack (which isn't anything worth mentioning - el-cheapo Richer Sounds rack) so I've got it on the floor between the speakers, sitting on a plank of MDF. Not exactly primo isolation, but I figured for power amps it wasn't so important..?

As to mains - just using bog-standard leads into a bog-standard 4-way extension block. I had a play with expensive leads a year or so back and couldn't hear a blinkin' bit of difference, so have steered well clear since then. I suppose I could be pursuaded to give it a try for the Classé............ As to actual mains isolation - that thar be mighty expensive doesn't it? Remember, I'm attempting to cheat here - high-end hifi with a budget not much greater than £0 at this point.....................

Cheers,

Dunc

 

Do you understand what it means? [Oh, and that spec fits the original requirement: good LF, loud and cheap!]

If you have more knowledge, then enlighten us.. Provide a robust counter-argument, demonstate your superiot knowledge. You can easily call me stupid, you'll have to work a lot harder to prove that I am stupid..

OK, then, what are the different "design principles" used to make studio vs home speakers? If I'm a speaker designer how do I quantify "enjoying the music" or "analysing recordings" and then how do I realize that in the design??

 

Prehaps Dat 19 is one of those sound engineers they keep locked up at abbey road, and only let out, when a load of xmas remasters are being released, to scare you into buying them.
Now we'll get a 637 page post about how 1 U rack studio gear is sooo much better then any £5K cdp, and that home hifi is so flawed, and that total accuracy above all else is paramount, yep these guys are responsible for fooking up your fave bands music so lynching is it good enough either that or he JW love child cross-bred with ferrite 'T' cells and digital Village DNA plus a mere smattering of 'slides fingers' oh what joy another escapee' from mixing desk anon

 

Hi Paul,

Good to know you are considering the ATC monitors. I love them, but I think you possibly knew that.

You don't really judge a hi-fi by the circuit diagram, do you? I thought you were a tune demmer...

What does the mosfet signature sound like? And does it vary from one application to another?

The ATC amps are simple because they don't need to be complex: the crossover has already done 'the hard bit' by the time the signal reaches each amp. Then all they have to do is drive a unit which they were each individually designed around without introducing distortion. No crossover distortion, and no phase inversion at crossover, impossible in a passive design, or so I'm led to believe. Why make life complicated?

ATC reckon you'd have to spend a fortune on conventional amps to better their actives. Others have confirmed this.