Help, my sound is too warm for rock

Current set-up: NAD 3240PE amp (15+ yr old), Sony CDP-497 cdp (10y/o), Wharfedale 9.1 speakers (new)(hence the 'problem').
On Order: Arcam cd62t, and tnt-audio cat5 cables to be built.
Room: ('Playroom', horrible, 5mx5m, low ceiling, laminate floors, plain walls, limited speaker placement options (one on a bookcase even!))

Right, basically I changed my speakers for wife approval from Celestion DL8s which were 'too big', but the wharfedales are sooo much warmer and don't give me the mid/bass clarity I want for rock music. It just seems like their little drivers are trying to do too much.

I have just read something that suggests I may be adding to this problem by getting the arcam (which may also be 'warm' but I do want to keep).

I don't mind spending up to another £300 max, but how do I get the cleaner sound I want again?
Auditioning kit is something of a non-starter, and I am not averse to buying second-hand.
I don't really mind if the amp has to be replaced, or even replacing my speakers (I would love floorstanders with two drivers for seperation but doubt if my upstairs room could take them?).
All advice welcome... Thanks.

 

If one speaker is placed on a bookshelf that suggests that it is close up to the wall - the wall will reinforce the bass and give very much the effect you describe. Since you say positioning options are limited, you'll have to work with that.

First thing to try - can you plug the ports up? Use some kitchen roll or packing foam or something, making sure you don't lose any inside. See if that improves matters.

If it does, but the sound still isn't quite as you want you then know the direction to go - get some small monitors designed for placement up close to a wall.

Also, have you blu-tacked the speakers down? This will also help.

 

That room isn't too small really (5 x 5m).

Seriously, if you want to "rock" then it may be difficult with the small Wharfedales I personally think that the classic wide baffle/shallow cabinet 3-ways are the best way to go for rock in a reasonable sized package.

JBL had it right with the L100 layout in my opinion.

 

Maybe some secondhand Monitor Audio GR10's. But they are rear ported... you will have to get it off that bookshelf.

 

Surely if it's a "playroom" your wife will let you off the leash a little and buy something bigger?

Rock and small two-ways just don't go together IMO.

Are we talking Guns'N'Roses/Led Zep rock or Coldplay rock here?

 

Thanks for advice so far, but speaker placement is a real issue - if I come off the shelf I cannot get equidistant from the rear wall (and I lose floorspace I need for guitarstand... eek)
I have already played around with positioning as best I can, I found that plugging the ports helped reduce boominess at volume, and the speakers are blu-tac'd to slate slabs.

The shelf is an open back unit (either 14" or 16" square) so I have some rear clearance but very little at the sides (and I am trying to break up reflection here with some poly-type blocks).

re "Rock and small two-ways just don't go together IMO" - yeah, I think I was naive to think that speaker development had moved on so much since I bought my DL8s many many moons ago.

 

Maybe some small active monitor are what you need, as many have a bass tilt control for adjusting them for use near to walls. They also have tighter bass in general.

 

Do you have or have you tried your speakers on good, solid stands?

IME can make a (huge) difference.

No, i know it may not be totally waf friendly.

 

Not much has changed in the bass department as far as I can see (you can't argue with physics no matter what the marketing people try to tell us)- things may have gotten slightly worse IMO.

As "Tenson" says, the only two-ways I have heard that rock are active. Seriously consider that idea, I doubt you will be dissappointed.

 

I've heard two-ways that rock, but they weren't bookshelf...

 

I think I'd go like this -

1) try speakers further into the room - still sound too warm?

2) borrow a big fat powerful amp from the dealer. Still sound too warm?

3) Start auditioning speakers

 

Thanks all, these forums are a great help for the relative newbie like me .... I have a good ear for music and know what i want to hear from my speakers but it is kinda hard to describe.

Anyway, I have wapped an Arcam cd62 cdp in and my sound has improved significantly - bizzarely I have more bass but it is also less boomy. Still not the sound I want because it still sounds a little 'compressed'. Lifting the treble helps but what it really needs is a little 'excitement' if that makes sense.

Anyway, I do have a few lines of attack now:

1) Get those bi-wire cables in
2) Look for a Tara Labs Missing Link to brighten my NAD and/or
3) Borrow my father in -law's Arcam amp to test (hehehe)
4) Do another speaker repositioning exercise with my atacama's from downstairs!

Thanks again. Phil.

 

Hi
I listen mainly to rock and blues, my system is Naim amps (122x and 150x) through Linn Keilidh speakers using qed silver aniversary cables. The Linns can be got on ebay for about 250.00 and do sound great with rock, they must have the kustone bases though. The midrange around vocals sound great, not a big massive soundstage but exceptional for the money. Hope this helps
Dave

 

Have you got too many soft furnishings and book shelves or something like it in the room. You could have a dead room.

 

I wouldn't bother with 1 and 2 personally.

 

Exactly what I thought.

 

Me three

 

Good idea!

NAD amps weren't exciting 15 year ago and they aren't any more exciting now.

Modern Arcams are pretty good and are not as warm and cuddly as the old Alpha amps used to be.

As for bookshelf speakers that can rock, the Dynaudio Contour 1.1

 

Yep - try the arcam amp but due to your speaker placement I'd look at front ported speakers or sealed enclosures if you're going to leave them in their current position. If you bring the stands in and play with placement I think you can confirm this. Now (..prepares to be shouted down...) if you leave the speakers where they are choice of speaker cable may make a big differece I'd try any of the lower end kimber cable or perhaps some DNM reson.

 

it's all about personal tastes...I've owned nad and myryad (ex arcam designer - but I don't know if they sound like arcam!) and the nad setup I had blew the myryad out of the water on every level...
tho nad do had reliability issues (had components break down on mself) and each subsequent amps I've had - none have been any better - just looked nicer!