How 'independant' are BBC playlists?

....or phrased differently 'why did the bbc play Kid Rock constantly for weeks until it reached number 1'?

I generally listen to radio 1 in the morning on my way to work, and radio 2 on my way home, and I'd been wondering for some time why both stations were playing this utterly shit song over and over again?
I've noticed before when radio 1 in particular has played currently unreleased songs absolutely to death, regardless of how crap they might be.

Am I being cynical here or are there back-handers going on to get certain records airplay?

 

Hi la toilette

It has ever been thus . All record labels will make suggestions to radio stations . Only the ultra specialist djs have any independance
at all . Most DJ's work from a play list ,all they do is talk and fill in the silences . How those play lists are worked out ,now that is an interesting question .

As to the Kid Rock song being poor , i actually like it . The mix of Werewolves of London and Sweet home Alabama works and i like it . I don't like anything else by him so far .

Regards D Louth

 

Ugh, I think that Kid Rock song is just middle of the road US cheese, with extra cheese on. It's not offensive, it's just bland pap to my ears. It's so dull that it made wonder why it was getting so much air play on the beeb. All IMO of course!

Anyway, yes I realise that DJ's have to follow the playlists for pretty much all the daytime shows; I recall Mark and Lard complaining that they were only allowed to choose 2 songs of their own during their entire 3 hr show. It's silly really, as it means that radio 1 gets incredibly repetitive, until you get to the evening shows. Mind you, most of the radio 1 DJ's are so bloody awful that I can't bring myself to listen to them at all, though perhaps that's down to my age - I'm not really in their target audience anymore!

Yeah, I reckon the the playlist clerks are also on the payroll of the record companies, there's definitely fishy behaviour going on for sure .

Dave

 

it's a money spinner for the label. Warren Zevon is dead, nearly all of Skynnard are, and Kid Rock didn't write shit.

Cash in the bank.

 

Hi Dave (La Toilette),

Out of interest, How old are you? I just want to know if you are in Radio one's target audience?

SCIDB

 

38.

Actually, I have no idea what radio 1's target audience is, probably anyone who's got a radio .

 

Hi,

Radio 1's target audience is 16 to 29 or people who's outlook matches this group. It seems that they are trying to get a youger crowd as well.

http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/organgrinder/2007/10/radio_1s_new_schedule_doing_it.html

http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/organgrinder/2007/10/radio_1s_new_schedule_doing_it.html

http://www.bbc.co.uk/commissioning/radio/network/docs/Radio1_audience.pdf

SCIDB

 

Hi,

Kid Rock wrote the lyrics. Most of Skynard that played on "sweet home Alabama" are still alive plus Billy powell played on the Kid rock tune.

As for cash in the bank, that is a big part of the music business.

SCIDB

 

Hi

Hi,

whether you like the song is not the problem. Record companies need enough people to like the song to make money.

I don't think the song is "utter shite". It is a catchy tune using a well known riff. It suits summer. Because of this, it has appeal to a young audience. On the whole, young people buy singles, download tunes, watch new releases on youtube.

Hi

All radio station have a target audience and a remit. They try and play music to suit their listeners. Radio one is a pop music station aimed at young people. These are the sort of people that will put tunes into the charts. But there is competition for chart places and saleS. Every week there are 100's of new tunes released. Only a few will get daytime play on Radio 1.

Record companies want their product played so record pluggers/promoters are employed. What these people do is to get their clients products into key prositions. In this case, on Radio one's playlist.

Record pluggers with send the radio producers/djs product in hope that they will play it. Meetings are held to decide what is featured. Good pluggers will try to send the right product to the right producers/djs. Certain djs have a good rep in breaking new tunes so it's not uncommon for these to get targeted heavily.

Any type of hook is used to get a record onto a playlist. If the tune has been a big hit in the USA, if the tune has big in the clubs, if the tune is big on the underground scene, if the band is on the verge of being big, if the tune/artist has had good specialist show plays, if the plugger has produce a good number of hit recently or in the past are all reasons that may get a record played.

Record pluggeing is big money and can cost many £1000s. Out of the many 100s of records in a week, very, very few will make it on the playlist.

Here is Radio 1's playlist

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio1/playlist/

A number of the tunes have been already released so there is only a few spaces for new stuff each week.

In the past, if you didn't get your record on radio 1, it was very hard to break into the top 40. Nowadays, there are loads of means to get you tune into the top 40. There has been a number that haven't been played on radio one but have got high into the charts.

The Kid Rock tune would have had good radio/dj plugging followed by plenty of air play and youtube downloads etc.

Radio stations are not in the payroll of the record companies. Like most industries, things are done to get a deal. There are plenty of perks and freebies. There will be plenty of pluggers buttering up producers and djs with this & that only for the product to flop.

If you look at last weeks chart there was only 6 new entries in the top 40. Only 4 of those new entries ar on the playlist.

As for being reptitive, that is how you sell records and get a tune familar. When people know a tune, they may hunt it out and buy it. This will lead to a high chart position which leads to more exposure and possible sales. It will promote the album. Kid Rock's current album is in the charts at No. 4. This has been his best chart postion in the UK.

SCIDB

 

Ok, I see that it might be a delicate job selecting what new songs make it to the play list, especially when there is doubtless pressure from various sources to play certain stuff.

....but surely this isn't really what the beeb is aiming at by being repetitive though is it, because if it is then surely that would be iffy!? It's not the beebs job to sell records; keeping the listeners happy and entertained with a variety of popular music should be their job, not promoting a fairly small list of songs/artists. Whilst airplay obviously effects sales, the charts should dictate the playlist (for radio 1 at least) not the other way around.

Of course we want to hear new stuff, but I've heard dj's playing singles repetitively when the song isn't due to released for several weeks. I can't see how this reflects public opinion, until the point at which they've made public opinion reflect their own by playing the song over and over again!

Obviously I'm not having a go at you here, if this is the way it's done then this is the way it's done, and perhaps this is the way it has to be done! But, as a long term listener I've always found radio 1 a bit too repetitive and seemingly increasingly so in recent years, and I think there should be more room for variety as that helps to make it entertaining.

Anyhoo, it's all somewhat academic as my car radio has packed up! Ha ha, typical, but at least it saves me from Kid Rock .

Sorry for all the Kid Rock fans out there, I know it's all down to taste, you either have it or you don't. Only kidding! (probably).

 

Hi

There can be a hell of a lot at stake with songs getting on a playlist. For a song to sell, people need to know about it. Getting a tune played at a keytime on a key show can make or break it. It can even make or break an act's career.

By having a playlist means that certain songs will be repeated more than overs. That is the nature of the beast. The cause for concern is what gets on the playlist and how it gets on the playlist.

IN the 50s, during the early days of rock 'n' roll, people saw how the music was selling & making money. Everybody wanted a piece of the action. Artists, groups, record labels sprang up overnight. They all wanted to make it.

Radio stations were key in breaking records. Certain djs had big power. These djs only had a limited time on air so they could only play some many tunes. 1000s of record were released so only a few would get large air play. They had to decide what gets played.

It wasn't uncommon for label owners, artist managers, record companies, etc to offer "incentives" to play their product. In those day, what was played was usually fully or mainly down to the dj.

The playola scandel of the 50s was due to Djs getting secret payments for playing and pushing certain records. The court case killed Alan Freed's career and helped to bring in playlists that were decided by producers, program managers, station owners and not usually the Djs.

At the end of the day, a radio station has to cherry pick a playlist. There is always going to be heavy debate to decide want goes on it.

Radio one has a job to entertain it's target audience. By nature of what it does, playing music, that will help to sell records. Having a play list means there will be a small number of acts getting peak daytime plays.

Charts should not dicate the playlist but playlists can help to dicate the charts. If a tune gets heavy plays then it can become popular which can lead to big sales and a hign chart prosition.

Part of radio one's remit is play new music. It defines new music as unreleased music or music that has a released less than a month ago. 45% of music played has to fit this remit. It also says that 40% of the acts should be from the UK.

The full remit is here. It makes interesting reading.

It is standard practice, to play tunes well before their release date. This helps to build up the popularity & familarity of the tune. It helps first week of release sales. Nowadays, a lot of records have their peak chart positions on after the first week of release.

Radio one is trying to get the opinion of it's listeners to like the station enough to carry on listening. They decide what to play and how to present it. Thety stand or fall by these things. If they get it right, they keep or increase their listenership. Get it wrong, they lose listeners.

No I don;t see you having a go at me. This is how the business is. I don't fully agree with everything about it but that is how it is done.

To be honest, Radio one has always been repetitive. That is part of the reason it is popular overall.

There is more variety out there, you just got to find it.

Overall Radio one appeals to some and not to others.

SCIDB

 

Not sure what you folks think of this but we've noticed it at work listening to Radio 2 all day. I was under the impression that the BBC were not allowed to plug products, as in "independent". However Radio 2 has had an "album of the week" for some time now which they play various tracks from throughout week - surely that's promotion?

Neil Diamond was the worst, they had seemingly endless interviews with him, concerts, live tracks and album tracks for weeks....just seems a bit of out character for what is supposed to an organisation that says "there are other xxxx available" after every company/product they accidentally mention.

 

Kid Rock makes appalling music, regardless of genre, he undoubtedly sucks imho.

Another possibly interesting example was Joe Whiley's constant plugging of 'The Automatic' immediately prior to and after their first big NME coverage. I believe that her husband managed them. Made Private Eye.

 

That F@!#$!ing 'Pretty Amazing Grace' song was played every ten minutes! Didn't mind it at first. :gatling: