Is any of this stuff any good?

I haven't bought the TD124 of my friend but he is no great rush to sell it so he's happy for me to play with it for a while. In return I have given it a good clean up and basic set-up/service.

Here I'm centring the platter on the main bearing using a dial test indicator. I managed to get the run-out down from 0.14mm to 0.04mm.

Experts will be keen to point out that the calibration should be done from the inside surface of the platter (the surface which the idler wheel touches). However without making an elaborate jig I can't see how this could be easily accomplished.



The TD124 certainly sounds very nice and I've decided that I prefer the VMS 30 mk2 fitted to the TD124 to the M20 FL Super which I have on the TD125. I'd have thought that the M20 FL was the superior cartridge but I definitely prefer the VMS. I think I'll be looking out for a good used VMS 30 Mk2 for my TD125.

 
I would think the VMS30 and the M20FL are practically the same thing bar the stylus holder colouring and the tip profile.

Despite the name changes all Ortofon MM class cartridges use the VMS (variable magnetic shunt) generator, including the old budget FF models from the 70s right up to todays 2M models.

I'd be inclined to hold onto the M20FL and look out for a NOS stylus, keeping it as spare. Likely the VMS30 sounds different due to the tip profile and perhaps slightly different compliance.

I've actually seen an OM stylus playing quite happily on a 2M body, and it sounds absolutely fine. You'd be amazed at how many 'radically new' designs are just the old one repackaged with perhaps a tweak or two :)


Ah here you go. Looks a bit daft but works!

 
I'd forgotten that my M20FL Super had the optional CAP 210 attachment fitted.

This little widget fits between the pins on the back of the cartridge and as the name suggests it adds 210pF of capacitance.



I believe 400pF total capacitance is optimal for both cartridges. My Trichord Dino is set to100pF. I've no idea what the capacitance of the interconnects etc adds up to.

Out of curiosity I removed the CAP 210 and hey presto the M20 FL Super now sounds very similar to the VMS 30 mk2.

I thought the M20FL was moving iron and the VMS was moving magnet but I could be wrong.
 
Ah the pesky little CAP210 which lurks on the pins of many a VMS. That would influence things for sure.

I think every MM class Ortofon from the mid 70s uses a VMS generator. Things have changed over the years in terms of pole piece design and generator inductance but the basic design is the same. And it works well so if it aint broke...
 
I can assure you Rob that diamond profile aside, the M20FL Super and VMS30 II are very different despite some similarities.

The 30 is a 1.3g approx high compliance cart with a soft bass and laid back presentation. The M20FL Super has lower compliance, tracks at around 1.7g and has a more direct quality, although I find the bass a bit strong and almost one-note sometimes - could be the arm compatibility causing this...

The 'thing' I found with my TD125mk1 was that it was charmless in its sound. maybe this is utter neutrality (:)) but the 124 just invites you to play record after record, the 125 just going through the motions - I'd have it back though ;)

The TD125 II could have a wobbly main bearing, as could the TD160's in original form. A more viscous oil can work wonders here, but it took Thorens a few years to wake up and sort this out. The mk1 was excellent though and the bearing housing could be removed for cleaning and service.
 
I'm only referring to the design internals which are at the core the same. They might well have tweaked things like compliance and damping, even changed the number of coil turns and therefore output a tad.

I still have a M20FL body here without stylus. Must find a NOS stylus one day but the well know auction site often has them for grossly inflated prices.
 
According to the cartridge database on the vinyl engine website:

M20 FL Super:

Tracking force 1.5g
Output voltage 4mV
Dynamic compliance 20 x 10-6cm/Dyne

VMS 30 mk2:
Tracking force 1.0-1.6g
Output voltage 5mV
Dynamic compliance 22 x 10-6cm/Dyne

Both turntables sound very good to me, I'd be splitting hairs choosing between them. Personally I love the looks and the vintage charm of the TD124 and I could happily spend the rest of my days taking it apart and putting it back together again just for fun. It's like a very expensive meccano set for grown-ups!
However from my listening over the last week I'd say the TD125 is the quieter deck. My money would be on the TD125 for ultimate SQ.

Rob, I got a replacement stylus for the M20 FL from Musonic, it was quite pricey though, I seem to remember it was about £100

There seem to be two versions of the stylus, one has a longer diamond than the other. My new one is the longer diamond type but I still have the stylus which came with the cart when I bought the TD125 and that one has a much shorter more 'pyramidal' shape diamond.
 
Both the Tandberg receiver and the Akai tape deck do actually work.

Well I don't have any tapes (sign of the times) but all of the play, fast forward, rewind functions work.

I didn't connect up an aerial to try the tuner on the Tandberg but the tape input and phone stage both work. It actually doesn't sound bad. Quite a vintage sort of sound with lots of warm bass but quite nice.
 


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