It all falls to bits ...

have you checked the phase of the system? this could be affecting things ? only a thought,,,,,,,

 

A good thought. An obvious thought.

 

Phase is fine - in my younger days I used to reverse it deliberately on the tweeters to give a "wider" sound ;-)

So I do know what it sounds like. I'm waiting for my new toy to turn up so I can really have a fiddle and mess up the sound more ! Also got some kontak on the way, to see if there are any improvements to be had there, I must admit I am sceptical about it's efficacies, we shall see.

Thanks for the suggestions.

 

Sorry, I only just noticed your question.

I bought my Dyns years ago. All the magazines were raving about them and two of my local dealers said that nothing came close at the price.
I listened to them in the dem room and even borrowed a pair for the weekend, but it was only after living with them for a few weeks, that I realised they weren't for me. It was as if all the raw energy and life was sucked out of the music. The bass seemed ok and detail was fine, but the midrange was recessed. I don't think it was a problem with the room because i've heard others say the same thing about Dyns - and my kefs were fine in that room.


I moved onto Linn kans (mk2), but had to use a subwoofer with them in the end (The lack of bass was doing my head in!). I was really happy with the results, but the kans need a bit of volume to come to life and sound a bit stressed when pushed too far. I've been through quite a few speakers since my Kans (Epos es 11, Dynaudio contour 1.3se, Naim SBL, Kef Q1, Tannoy DMT monitor 10, AR18, Royd minstrel + borrowed a few)
I'm now living with some Tannoy 611's and really like what they do. They are good at low and high volumes, bass goes deep but is pretty tight. Vocals are very good too.


If you're happy with the balance of the speakers, then i'd say the problem could be a combination of the system and room interactions. A better preamp can help the sound at lower volumes, but they will never sound great at low volumes. For that you'd need more sensitive speakers (You don't want them too sensitive with Naim gear though)

Sorry for rambling. It looks like I gave a bit more info than you asked for.

 

Hi Matt,
thanks for your input - I've got hold of an old pair of Rogers JR149, a strange looking cylindrical device, cosmetically poor, but soundwise very good. Rated at 15R. It works well at low volume too, it has a decent midrange, top is a bit ragged though. What bass it has seems decent, but the lower octaves isn't it's forte. I reckon it can do with crossing at 100Hz and a pair of sealed subs or perhaps dipoles. I've done some digging and it's supposed to have the same drivers as the BBC speaker ls3/5a with similar crossover. It reminds me of Linn Kanns.

I must admit is really suited the music I used to listen to, 70s,80s stuff. Now my music repetoire has expanded, it doesn't really work with everything, but I think it needs more room than I have to shine.

Ok - it seems like I should be looking at the Tannoy Sixes or perhaps the KEF Codas. I'll see what I can find.

Thanks very much for detailing your speaker "voyage". btw what sort of amplification are you using ?

I might change the Naim gear, I bought it to satisfy my curiousity and it did work well with the music I liked then, before that it was a Avondale 260z, Mission Cyrus II, NAD 3130, Sony TAF40.

Cheers

 

.
The JR149 are supposed to be very good little speakers. The ragged top end will be mainly coming from the 62 preamp (I know because I have two of 'em) You can remove some of the ragged top end with sympathetic cable choices, but I find it also removes some of the music - I wouldn't recommend it.

The best way to sort out the top-end is DIY. If you're not happy with a soldering iron, then a change of amp or maybe speakers would be the best option. An Avondale arcam CD player would also help smooth out the top end, but without smoothing out the music.

For Subwoofers - BK elecronics sell a nice little sub for around £300. I know at least two forum members that use them and they seem happy. I used a Rel strata 5.

Everyone has different tastes when it comes to speakers and you may not like them, but at least you wouldn't lose anything if you decided to try some of these old'ish speakers.
The Tannoy 609 is supposed to be a good little standmount speaker. It uses the same mid/tweeter as my 611, but without the extra bass driver. The last pair sold on ebay for around £60.
You maybe better off finding an amp to suite your speakers though, rather than changing speakers. I've heard complaints of the Tannoys having a ragged top end too, but mine sound as smooth as silk with my system.

I have three CD players - Two Arcam alpha 5 and a Cambridge audio 640v2.
I have two Naim 62 preamps and a Starfish (DIY Naim style preamp)
My power amp is a Chrome bumper 250 and I also have an Onix oa21 integrated amp
All of my gear is DIY moddified, and I must say, learning to DIY hifi is the best thing I ever did.

 

While you are about it, check the phase of the moon as well. Doing that has about as relevance to your problem as many of the other fruit-loop suggestions you have received.

Chris

 

These might help.

http://www.pinkfishmedia.net/forum/showthread.php?t=49392

http://www.pinkfishmedia.net/forum/showthread.php?t=49345

 

I've got changeequipmentitchitis:

Speaker - balanced, floor standing, upto 1m high, 22cm wide, 30cm deepish. High sensitivity pref, better than 89dB/m, easy load. Sealed box or horn. Floorstanding, sounds good at low volumes. Nice looking !

Amplifier - balanced, effortless, non-fatiguing, at least two line level inputs, good bass control, non-valve output, hybrid ok. Must work well at low volume as well.

Music, nearly everything, bar thrash metal and heavy duty organ music at 20Hz !

What would be suitable?

I'll be buying secondhand.

 

I don't know why this threads gone quiet - strange!

What's your budget?

If you live anywhere near Cheltenham You're welcome to borrow an Onix OA21 integrated amp.

 

Thanks for the offer Matt, I'm in Surrey, so it'll be quite a trek, but thanks all the same.

I think the problem is with the room not liking the speakers or the speaker not liking the room. I have a Behringer DEQ2496 which may or may not be successful in taming the room & speakers, hopefully without too many negatives. I've read that people have had very good results with it.

I'm also looking at other techniques, like open baffle speakers.

Budget ? Not a lot, I'll need to sell my Dynaudio 52s and the Naim gear (NAP110 and NAC62). So whatever they fetch will be my budget-ish.

 

To be honest, all the Onix would do is give you a more refined sound.

I was temted to try some open baffles not so long back. Some say it's hard to go back to a boxed speaker once you've lived with open baffles.

 

An update : I've sold the 52s, the 110 and 62 are about to go, STP.

I've been tracking the prices of the Tannoy Sixes for the last four months, I reckon the word has gone out and they've gone up.

At the risk of helping other speakers appreciate, are there any other speakers that are worth listening to?

Also do speakers deteriorate, apart from physical damage, rubber surrounds perishing ? I'm thinking more in the line of ferrofluid drying out etc.

I'm not looking to spend much more than £300, I need to leave some money for the amplifier too. If I get a more sensitive speaker or one that presents a benign load, then I can look at smaller amps. If the speaker has a load that only the best from Sizewell can handle, it'll have to be a MC2 or similar.:JPS:

Cheers