power cables

would it be a good idea to upgrade the power cables on my amp and cd player? both of which are hard wired.

i dont think it will be that hard to make some up myself, what cable would you recommend, without spending a massive amount of mney, and also will std homebase 3pin plugs do the job or would u recommend something better?
thx
matthew

 

I asked the same question about a month ago and I was advised against it. However I was tryng to do it on the cheap.

 

yeah i wanted to do it "on the cheap", surely there must be something better than std 3core flex?

 

Well, in my opinion, no, there isn't. I regard the whole thing as a total waste of money. I've tried a highly-recommended power cable and it brought precisely no difference whatsoever to everything into which it was plugged. I firmly believe that you cannot "upgrade" a bit of wire. However, there are folks who swear by them (rather than at them, as I do), so do read both sides of the story, for example:

https://www.audio-forums.com/as-rediect/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2258

and then try one out. If you like the results, it's for you.

 

is a A400 hard wired?

I've got a A400-X and that's got a IEC socket.

 

yeah the 400 is hardwired, i have been looking aswell and the cable isnt std, its quite a bit thicker, whether or no thats just the dylectric i dont know.

 

Well if I'd seen your post I'd have probably said that there are a couple of cables in the RS catalogue that might fit the bill.

The first is there cy control cable [get the higher rated version], the second is a double screen cable that loks pretty good but cost a lot ...you need to buy a 50m roll at £120 odd quid.

The two ways of replacing captive leads are

one chop the cable to a couple of inches from the back of the unit and fit a female IEC plug to the end.
two open the box and cut and fit a IEC socket to the back panel.

I've done both and enhanced the units moddified.

These options allow the use of any IEC mains cable.

A third way would be open the unit and captive fit your choice of exotic cable.

The CY cable is best made into the TNT TTS but does work as a single length.

You need to consider that these are filters so you need a reasonable length of cable to get any effect, I normally work on 1.5-2m lenghts as a minimum.

I've a roll of cy cable abot 50% left if your intrested pm me.

 

Matthew,

buy yourself a better amplifier or CD-Player or speakers or maybe some new Cds.

I believe you will be much more happier.

 

I wouldn't really bother with the Cy or silflex cables, a Tones style upgrade at best. Just forget about power cables they don't work it's been scientificaly proven by millions of ex grads with 3+ degrees and eons of proof, who'll swear blind there's no difference, why even entertain the thought, it's all bollox, my system runs suprememly well on stock cables, so much so I make a meager exsistance by selling O.E. kettle leads, they are fab, so a trip to newe & aryes, will sort you my lad, now go forth and purchase you new lease of audio nivania.

 

are these comments restricted to the cables, or do you believe that there is no adverse influence from the electrical supply - ie would 'purifiers' or power supply isolated from domestic evils (like fridges, etc) also be a waste of dosh.

- like the idea of additional CDs being best value upgrade though. At this time of year, that extra glass of wine also seems to work!

 

Pete, I was being a touch cynical for the benfit of the tape m' lud, and even with mains regenerators & power conditioners, just see what happens when you change, the input cable to them, even the mauch vaulted PS audio range of regen's gains a big kick in the pants when you give it a decent power lead, and not there lab cable either
All the power conditioners in my system have been 'restructured' by a fair margin. It's so much negitivity around at ther moment, hence why I can't be bothered atm T.

 

Hiya tony,
Honestly mate I dont think thats true. People seem just to be expressing their opinions as they see them, and it needs the other side of the coin aswell to give people both sides...

I think this place needs you to be as positive about them as you've always been

Cables do seem to be one of those subjects which people either dont value or rave over.

My own view has been moderated by a few bake offs... I now think that in some situations some power cables can affect a change in sound. Some people will prefer the change and consider it an upgrade. Some people will consider the change different but not necessarily better. There can nevertheless be a discernable difference in sound by changing the power cable.

I know thats kind of ''loose'' - but I know you too have tried some power cords and not heard a difference between stock... and also massively varying levels of success with different systems?

It'd be fun to try all the conditioning/silencing/regeneration doo-hickies one day, as Ive never really played with them..

Matthew - my best advice would be to try and get your hands on about 4-5 of them... places with money back guarantees so you can send whichever back that didnt do what you wanted. Pete's advice was bang on about what to do... personally I'd fit an IEC so you can use whatever you want at any point, and would make trials a lot easier!!!

happy x-mas
Chris

 

Power cables are a small issue Chris, and certainly not the only one, all views are valid, and peoples expressions are needed, else would be a naff place However openmindedness would a nice change on more than a few issues, although Titain & I have had our differenices, he summed it up well on the muppet forum


Is Christmas over? good

If you really want to see the debate 'if cables really make a difference' from the right point of view, well, then there shouldn't even be a debate:

All those guys who say that cables don't make any difference should be excluded from any kind of statistics concerning music, because:

1) They have such a s*** of a hifi that maybe you can call it SOUND or NOISE reprodution system.

2) These persons don't even know the difference between music and sound. They are so used to listen to their sound with all the s****iest equipments in this world (including mobiles, ipods, computers,...) that they don't even know anymore what is part of the music and what not. Actually, they never ever knew that. For them everything is music as long as it makes noise, has a certain beat and therefore can make any part of his body move (rock would be too positive) and terminates in less than five minutes. Important their 'music' must be played in the background while doing other 200 things. The only difference they can hear in sound is: 50db, 75db, 100 db, slow, fast, quick, boaring, not boaring, cool,... Anyway what can you expect more from the modern life?


oh, I forgot something: this could also be said to those who affirm cables make a difference.

Wm

 

Well Titian,
if you feel like answering in this way you should at least explain yourself and tell the reasons of this categorical answer which could be wery well missunderstood. I know it wasn't your intention to offend anybody, neither to discrimitate power cords in which you do believe in, but nobody can really immagine that, unless he knows you quite well.
I believe that your concern is that people should enjoy more the music than gear and, if they are really interested or willing to have a better system, then they should concentrated in what you mean by quality sound. That is according to you also achieved by power cords but as one of the last steps that means when the rest of the components have already reached a certain level. Titian, you must also realize that not everybody thinks in the same way and therefore have other priorities and would be happy to keep what they have and try to optimize it with (for example cables. For those people the suggestion from bottleneck is the one with which I would completely agree. And to conclude, I don't know if a snake bit you during Christmas but, try to relax, enjoy life ... and music.

 

Audiophile 240v power cables eh? next it'll be a personal £50m russ andrews power station :MILD:

Seriously though, how do they work anyway? what diffrences in sound should be expected from this type of upgrade?

O

 

Mains Cables

The eternal debate

To put things in context, the main detractor is unable to distinguish between a Cd player and a Linn LP12. No problem here, but if you feel you could tell the difference, then maybe his comments should be taken as being unrepresentative of your own.

I can only talk of certain mains cable designs, those created to reduce the affects of RFI and EMI. Basically most digital electronics (CD, DVD etc) do create significant amounts of these as a byproduct, both conducted and radiated.

The conducted EMI will go somewhere by neccessity. Typically this will be fed down your mains cable and "pollute" other components sharing the same mains feed. Additionally, the Radiated EMI, at it's most powerful close to digital sources and displays, will seek to penetrate the mains supply at it's weakest point, the cables.

The likes of Eupen and Shunyata are designed to prevent both of these occurences, by absorbing and dissipating the EMI in the cable structure (typically above 100mhz). They work If it's accepted in Military circles and given MilSpec approval, then it does what it claims.

Now whether you beleive there is a problem to solve in the first place is another matter, but I have seen enough evidence to suggest that most digital components benefit. In fact the most graphical demonstration was the affect of a Shunyata cable on the picture quality of a Plasma screen, when applied to either the DVD source or the screen itself.

So my take on it is that some mains cables work well with some electronics for sound scientific reasons. But simply changing your mains lead for something different is a recipe for disappointment, and there are a lot of Snake Oil salesmen out there jumping on the bandwagon.

 

Yep, I don't think the cable debate is going away soon. I'm afraid stuff like this http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&[email protected] does make you question it.

Quote: "Tom Nousaine has proctored dozens (hundreds?) of such
attemps with no winners....not even the founder of a high end
wire manufacturer using his own system."

I mean, a $5000 reward in the US? £1000 in the UK? And still nobody has done it.

And if this is true, it makes the fact that so much expensive cable is sold all the more remarkable.

 

Do note that the challenge you highlight has nothing to do with the power cord issue, I understand it to relate to signal cables. I cannot say I have blind tested speaker cables, although I have done so (unwittingly I might add) with mains feeds and the difference was not subtle on a Theta Pro Gen Va.

 

This would be very easy to measure. Have measurements been taken and are they available for us to look at?

 

Hi Joel,

to my knowledge, no one has published lab results. This seems strange, but I am equally surprised that the nay sayers have not attempted any tests to disprove any manufacturers claims. Surely that would be equally simple?

Regarding Eupen, I do beleive that they are constructed from a Military spec cable. I was recently speaking with a bod from Cranford who worked on Harriers. It seems a similar cable is used in most military aircraft to reduce the effect of EMI on the instruments and improve their performance. I do have illustrations as to the affects, but only in Pdf format I'm afraid. Still, my experience suggests that if a product gains mil spec approval claiming that it performs a certain task, the likelihood is that it indeed does so.

Again I am surprised that the likes of Tom Nousaine have not produced any results to show that the manufacturer's claims are incorrect, as you say, it would easily be measured, although I happily accept there is much in the hifi arena that isn't.

I'm sure it could be easily shown that the addition of feedback to many valve amplification stages improves distortion figures and therefore sound quality! Case proven, but what do your ears tell you?