[Review] 3-way Supertweeter Test

mmm that's funny, as i can rotate the ST heads of my kefs by about ten degrees and i prefer them running about 5 degrees wider than the rest of the speaker which points straight at me.

 

How close do you sit to your Kefs and how far are they from room boundaries?

 

they are spaced 8 feet apart, 2 1/2 feet from sidewalls, about the same from the back wall and toed in to cross at 8 feet.

for classical i sit about 2 feet behind the cross and for everything else just in front.

 

Thanks. Without knowing the RT60 of your room it's difficult to be precise but in the absence of a wall close behind your listening position, you are getting a reasonably high ratio of direct to reflected sound.

As you are listening on axis, you are getting a flat treble response from your Kef. I don't know how they roll their super tweeters in? I presume it's built in to the original design so there will be a low pass on the tweeter?

Not long ago I had the pleasure of talking with Greg Timbers - head designer of JBL and resonsible for many of their great speakers over the past thirty five years. I asked him about the supertweeter on the new E2 - especially as it rolls in 4th order at 20khz. Greg's response was typically candid. They can't sell speakers, particularly in Japan, unless the response goes up past 30khz. In his speakers at home he simply disconnects them - assuring me that the lack of comb filtering results in vastly superior results in audio terms. A shame the marketing boys have done such a good job in this case was Greg's assessment. Of course, as a leading light withing the AES and working alongside Floyd Toole, Greg could be talking out of his arse and you guys might just be onto something....

 

Kindergarten, full of content, typical post...

 

How can you, using horns and Berning, call someone leftfield... :newbie:

 

Someone kindly posts an interesting piece about Simon's excellent new Super Tweeters and World War IV breaks out about something else. Needs a thread tidy I think but not before an argument about the current costs of Vet's bills.

 

:argue:

 

Because there is genuine and irrefutable scientific reasoning behind the design of both products. I think your understanding of horns appears to be minimal, given your recent comments regarding monitors.

None of my system uses holistic magic or essential oogamaflips.

Larkrise,

apologies if the advertorial has got sidetracked but I'm afraid when Melorib interjects with "get a life" these things tend to happen. Unfortunate. I'm all for a good arguement, but I prefer to have one with someone who can debate the product in question - not with someone who doesn't understand the question and resorts to name calling.

 

I dont see melorib on the off topic post that started it all...

 

Hang on a minute? Advertorial??? Isn't Paul's review in the bit where it says post a review of interesting hi-fi you have heard recently - to quote 'Your views on kit you've listened to' which is exactly what Paul (Melstock) did - or is the Review section now to be known as the Advertorial section?

I'd better be careful or I'll be accused of side tracking too!

 

I personally don't think when Michael wrote "Your views on kit you've listened to" all those years ago, he envisaged it being used by mates to discuss DIY efforts from a forum user just starting a business - but that's my view.

I think I can drop that now - hopefully anyone reading this will now be aware of the history behind the review and manufacturer and the external links to this page. That was my only concern.

 

Ahem. For the record, Simon (Tenson) isn't a mate as I understand the term (no offence Simon) - he contacted me via the forum following my post of a review of JAS super tweeters compared to the Townshends, which interestingly didn't upset anybody! I've got to know him a bit better via a few PM's giving him some initial feedback on my opinion as he was keen to know what a Super tweeter fan thought of his efforts - never met him, never spoken to him. And Paul - Melstock bought an amp from me some years ago and we chat about hi-fi since on the phone. The idea for Melstock to try these out was mine alone (not Simon's) as my Krell was away for a protracted service and I couldn't audition properly with al the kit i was familiar with. His decision to post was his alone and as far as I can tell was in the interests of an independent honest opinion.

So - I too hope that this helps clarify the history behind the review and manufacturer - which is also MY concern. I'm going to be posting an opinion on kit I've listened to recently also, as I sometimes do icluding an amazing preamp find, but it wont be an advert it will be an opinion and I do hope it isn't going to get anyone hot and bothered!

I genuinely hope this comment helps, now back to the hand cream.

 

I do hope it's from a reputable company that we've heard of.

Anyone out there doing preamps?

 

Tell you what - in the spirit of not sharing your discoveries with forum members - I wont bother.

I give up. . . . .

 

It looks like you are in some of those companies payroll, or are they giving you freebies, in return for your vigilance...

 

Warning off topic, off topic.

I don't really see what the 'reputable company' bit means.

If by reputable you mean 'established HiFi manufacturer', then I don't really see how that would make it any more valid.

Can Prometheus or Bent audio be considered an example of a reputable company? Both of these (to the best of my limited knowledge) have been reviewed heavily by purchasers on Internet forums such as this one, pinkfish, audiogon, audio asylum etc. There has never been a problem there and the manufacturer often interjects with comments / advice on implementation.

Tenson has had his products (the DEQ) reviewed independently by TNT audio (not purchasers) is this review more valid than the one posted here on the super tweeters?

I don't think there is much difference in the opinions or the tone of this article when compared to the excellent Berning review Stereomic posted. Although it should be noted that in that case Mic had already purchased the Bernings.

Nor would there be any more relevance to me if it appeared in an article in a hifi magazine.

 

Precisely

 

Scott,

I just see so many people building at home and creating a stir on the internet - that proves long term to be hype and nothing else. Very few internet promoted companies go on to become long term players in the hifi industry - primarily because people get their products via ebay or whereever and realise after a few months it's not really what was claimed. Acoustic Reality would be the first I came across many moons ago. Cable companies have sprung up here and on other forums that sell you a worthless piece of junk with zero market value. Tweaks and modifications that apparently work because someone with five fuckin' posts raves about it and the manufacturer comes on board to say "thanks". The list is endless and a bugbear of mine.

Your TNT review is a case in point. A guy clearly beset with the idea that nos dacs and the like bought from flea bay represent very real references. And who the hell is Nick Whetstone? What's his forum name?

Here's how I see it being fair. Anyone feeling that their product is revolutionary, enlighhtening or anything else, should bring it along to a once a month meeting of forum members, where it can be installed in a system and everyone from across the forums can then give their opinion and write a candid review on the various forums. Organised bake offs if you like. That way, the product is subjected to scrutiny from a cross section of members - massively reducing the chances of unwarranted hype.

The difference with established manufacturers like say an Audio Research amplifier, is that they have been trading for many years on the back of a reputation built up by both the mainstream press and the audiophile word of mouth. One backed up by the other over a period of time is pretty convincing in my eyes.

 

"Here's how I see it being fair. Anyone feeling that their product is revolutionary, enlighhtening or anything else, should bring it along to a once a month meeting of forum members, where it can be installed in a system and everyone from across the forums can then give their opinion and write a candid review on the various forums. Organised bake offs if you like. That way, the product is subjected to scrutiny from a cross section of members - massively reducing the chances of unwarranted hype."

This is how reviewing should work is it?

LOL

Should we also apply this to reviewing books, restaurants, films, etc etc - as a former reviewer for City Life, Time Out, The Independent and The Times amongst others (ie know a bit about how reviews work) I find this a bit difficult to grasp - a review also has an individuals stamp on it as for example with Pauline Kael's film reviews - so the way forward for Hi fi reviewing is for
a series of little parties?

LOL LOL

This is great fun, more, and I am trying to break away to do my accounts!