Sacd

setting myself a budget of about £250 for a cd player i am now considering buying a sacd player instead, what are your opinions on sacd and is there anything i should know about them, except the expensive small range of music that is available.

whats a hybrid SACD too i have seen some of these for sale?

thx
matthew

 

Hybrid discs have a CD layer and an SACD layer. They are SACDs that play CD quality on an ordinary CD player.

I just got a Philips 963SA to play around with. It's plummed into my TAG AV system at the moment. Can't tell you too much more as I haven't got enough SACD discs to start making proper comparisons.

 

a hybrid is a disc with both a SACD layer and a regular CD layer. Hence, they'll play on both types of machine. If you have a SACD player you can choose which type of layer you want to listen to.


SACD players from Sony and Pioneer are worth looking at. However, for CD playback a dedicated player such as a NAD C541i will sound better than the SACD players, IMO.

SACD versus CD would be closer though.

 

Several choices here - although at this level of cash, I'd go for a dedicated CD player:

+ Pioneer DV-565 - this is universal DVD player that does DVD-Video, DVD-Audio, SACD and CD.

+ NAD C521BEE - a CD player only, but a cracking one at that. I don't have any SACDs, but over 500 CDs, so decided this was the best option. Added a Pioneer DV-350 for DVD-Video duties.

+ Cambridge Audio Azur 540C / 640C - again CD player only

Basically, audition what you can and decide what you want to go for - the list I've provided simply gives you a few starting points.

 

anyone else have any views on the pioneer unit?
thx

 

A CD only player, would MOre than likely better the SACD player for standard CD playback. So if this is where your priorities are, then maybe a dedicated CD player is best.

However, the universal player is another option, then adding a decent offboard stereo DAC later.

I use a DVD player with an stand alone DAC and want to change the DVD player along the line, and will probably go for a decent universal player.....

 

I recently dem'd a couple of SACD players.

Frankly the Pioneer 565 sounded dire even on SACD, I couldn't bring myself to subject even more pain with the use of CD.

The second SACD player (Marantz DV6400) was however a different kettle of fish. Never tried it on CD, but probably acceptable. On DVD was about on par with a Tosh 330.
The key point was that on SACD, was rather special. I dem'd it against two MUCH more expensive CD players. Against an Arcam 93 in the shop, I felt that the Marantz on SACD gave it a real good kicking.
At home, and against a nearly run in Naim CD5i, it also outperformed it in certain areas (holographic imaging, midrange etc). However, was a little slow and leaden in the bass and rather lacking in life.

So overall, the Marantz would be a pretty good buy if you didn't already have a DVD player. Can't say I'd buy one just for CD. Buy a good dedicate CD instead.

 

Well I use the Pioneer DV656 (£400 when new. Now selling for at least half of that 2nd hand these days) . I think it sounds fantastic. I connect it up to my Marantz SR7200 with B&W600 series all round, and it produces wonderful results. One proviso though. I had to put pretty decent cables on it to get a this sound (3xBlack Rhodium Symphony). I use it as multi-channel. I now have upgraded to Black Rhodium Concerto and the sound is wonderful. All the nice adjectives you can think of. Gives my MF DAC A324 a good run for its money (but of course 2 very different sound experiences.

Makes a bloody good DVD player as well.

 

Your review on the Marantz and Pioneer makes very interesting reading. One question. Do you still need 5 analog cables to connect your SACD player to the amp or have they come out with a better solution already? When it comes to spending money on cables I have a severe allergic reaction.

 

Wolf,

Both of the dems I completed used stereo only SACD and CD. I'm simply not a big believer in multichannel music.

 

Thanks. From that I guess you do need as many leads per channels then. Oh well.

Did you keep the Marantz in the end? I have a few hybrid SACD but no spinner yet. Hence the temptation to buy a new player.

 

Wolf,

Nope, certainly didn't keep the Marantz.
Of the Pioneer and Marantz, the marantz was easily the best and definitely worth the extra cash (check online using Kelkoo and there's some very good prices on the Marantz).
Problem was that in my home system in some ways SACD sounded better than my Naim CD player, but in other ways it sounded worse. (3D imaging was awesome, but it had bugger all life and enjoyment in it).

I could picture myself a year from now just being frustrated with both players as neither would be capable of fully satisfying me just because of their different strengths and weaknesses.
So in the end, took it back to the shop and intend to focus on just CD so that I optimise things for a single format, and make best use of the 500CDs we already have.

Consider the cost of the Marantz (£300) along with the cost of any disks that you'd buy if you owned an SACD player. Then think of how much better you'd make your home system by spending this cash on the CD/stereo side of things.
For me, that would be a replacement pre-amp and would make a significant upgrade.

 

I'm not sure a review of the marantz DV6400 and the Pioneer DV565 is particulaly fair as the Marantz is 50% more expensive (may only be £100 but at that price bracket thats a big difference and you would expect the Marantz to be a bette performer!) ,

Yes Wolfgang you do need actually 6 cables to connect the player to the amp for multi channel. Personally I rather enjoy it. But I can understand its not to everybodies taste.

You can pick up the Pioneer DV656 for about £250 new and £180 second hand. At this price I personally consider it a bargain (I paid full price for mine and don't regret it for a minute!).

 

Saur>

Don't you think you're being a little defensive?

Furthermore, I've seen the Marantz available for £270 (check using www.kelkoo.com if you want confirmation).
So what we're looking at is £20 more in cost, and a massive improvement in ability whilst playing SACD disks.

I can assure you that I have no underlying reasons for recommending either apart from sonic. After all, I didn't buy either, so I would hope that my opinion is fairly objective as I'm not trying to justify my own purchasing decision.

 

sorry Mr_Sukebe didn't want to come across as defensive.

But the Pionerr 565 is availble for less than £200 (in fact just seen it at empiredirect for £191). So actually a £80 difference. I just wanted to point out that at this price bracket £80 is a big difference and so you would expect the marantz to win.

I've never heard the DV6400 and personally highly rate Marantz kit for the value for money (I own the CD4000 and SR72000).

Just putting another point of view in.

As always I strongly advocate listening to these things yourself.

For £200 you will struggle to beat the all round performance of the 565. As for its SACD playback, I've not heard it, but is a good way of trying the format without too much outlay, and get a great performing dvd player thrown in.

 

Saur,

You raise an interesting point, i.e. that of performance generally of mid-range DVD players.

I've seen a variety of DVD players around that price, and frankly once you're into the Tosh 220 or above area, there seems to be virtually bugger all difference in DVD performance if you're limited to RGB scart.
I've compared at home the Marantz 6400, a Tosh 220, Tosh 330, Pioneer 535, and in reality the differences are virtually negligible.

On CD, all the ones I've heard sound simply pants when compared to anything like a decent dedicated CD player or old DAC.

So in the case of the Pioneer 565 the additional cost above say a Tosh 330 (approx £120) is all going towards it's ability to play SACD and DVD-A. Based upon what I've heard of the SACD ability of the 565, I'd question the idea of spending that much, as it really wasn't good at all.

Clearly the Marantz is more expensive when compared, but I really didn't think that it justified it's cost, and that it justified the extra easily.
Please don't just take my word for it, if you struggle to believe that, go have a listen. After all, it's me that's dem'd the two, not yourself.

 

I agree the Toshiba 330 is a fantastic player for the money (and my choice for a sub £150 player hands down).

Now I have compared a lot of players too, similar ones to you (although not he DV6400 or the 565 directly )and can say that the 656 IMHO gives a good picture (using RGB Scart) and sound improvement for DVD over the Toshiba and that the SACD playback is quite frankly astounding for the price! This can be had for as little as £229 now at empire direct (can't argue with that).

I admit I've never heard the 565 but have read reviews that state its close to the 656 (What hifi. D'oh! stupid me!) obviously not the case.

If you are looking for a great performing DVD player and want to dabble in SACD and DVD-A I can't recommend it strongly enough.

Admitably the CD playback can be a bit thin and lifeless but it makes a suprisingly fine transport for use with a DAC.

I guess it really depends what you are looking for?

 

One other suggestion to throw into the ring is the Sony DVP-NS930 - their top DVD/SACD player (before you get to the expensive ES range).

It doesn't do DVD-A but that's about all it doesn't do. Should be a pretty decent SACD player, offers PAL and NTSC progressive scan and, if previous 900 series Sony's are anything to go by, it shouldn't be too bad at all as a CD player.

Best bit is that whereas previous Sony 900 players used to retail at £500, you can pick up the new 930 for an astonishing £222 including delivery (from digital-point.co.uk).

I must say that I'm very tempted myself.

Matt.

 

Personally it would be nice it one could compare a few of these in shops. However, it does seem very tempting with prices like this online. It is almost the same for a pair of designer label interconnects.