The effect of vibration on the music playing system or

Evidence is an interesting thing though.
Remember the Japanese transistor amps in the 70s, i.e. "it measures better, therefore it is..."
Another opinion is that we still haven't learned what the right measurements are that would allow us to base all hi-fi purchasing judgements solely on empirical results.
As such, the only thing left is to listen and see what you prefer the sound of.
So now I really don't pay much attention to the specs of kit beyond assisting in system synergy (e.g. I sometimes play music loud, so absolute volume capability of my amp/speaker combo is of importance).

 

There's a difference between saying some thing are measurable but not audible, and saying that some things are audible but not measurable.

I often think people get the two states of affairs confused.

 

Yes, right.

Except I think a few people off this forum agree with my observations.

No I don't have scientific papers, I grant you......but people have obviously been researching this and from their notes on the web (I think) theres issufficiently mileage in it.

I apprecate you concerns about giimiks/ audio money spinners/ snake oil / general rip offs.

Me too; but in my experience this works!

Mike, mate, whilst I applaud your approach, I don''t have the funds for scientific measuring equipment.

Nor can I afford to build up several systems in order to replicate my (any) successes.

I make cones for those who want to try them.....then they can decide for themselves!

Any issues....money back!

 

"I just knocked up some new cones for my valve amp....biggish ones 4"x1"...these were made with a rather deeper hole than before...."

...my own quote above from a few says ago....

This evening i put similar ones under my cdp......IMO comfirming my own query on whether size matters.

These are the best yet.

Doing very well (though say it myself ), extending the soundstage back again........

 

ZeroPimp

 

One of the reasons why I believe some magazine put effort into turntable support resonance, arm resonance and cartridge etc.

Another case is how one support will be affected by an old wooden supported floor, a modern supported floor and a concrete structure.
Indirect or direct sound radiation.
frequency and frequency extension.
Proximity.
Traffic.

Many variables, again a couple of which were touched on by reviewers, experimenting with inner tubes and such in basements with accelerators etc.

Why some CD companies put some effort into CD player resonance and construction.

Indeed why in the earlier years some developement was considered worthwhile.

 

I don't get it? (yes, that as well, but I do have very young kids and a busy stressfull life, whats your excuse)

 

And what is correct and what is regarded Foo Foo?

Reminds me of Bee's and flight, and Dogs and Cancer...

 

David, I didn't realise you were sellling isolation devices - I'm sorry.

Even more reason to need some independent verification IMHO. Why not try to take part in/organise some blind tests? What harm can it do? If say Sideshow, Bottleneck, you and I had heard improvements under controlled conditions, it's highly unlikely we would come onto threads pointing out the blatent failings in your reasoning. That's got to be good for you surely?

 

blind test this blind test that ......they don't work

use those flappy things god gave you ....oh and engaging the brain to process the information recieved.

if you can hear an improvement, why would you then blind test unless its to act as mental crutch to support you judgment. If your judgment is so uncertain then your in the wrong hobby imo....how on earth did you ever buy any gear in the first place or did you let someone else choose for you ?

It comes down to the ability of the individual to be able to hear these sonic nuances ....if you can't then don't tell other people who can they don't exist.

Acceptable proof post .....seems to have vanished ?

Acceptable to whom ?....proof is proof and once proven has to by definition be accepted by all.

 

That's what I'm suggesting instead of those blinking things up front - surely you understand that?

 

Well, if you really believe that diatribe I suggest spend some time looking at some basic science on the subject of bias.

http://confirmation-bias.behaviouralfinance.net/

Here is a link to many many papers and links. This subject is both old and well known, to all apart from certain types in the snake oil business.

 

OK so prove your ability to hear these sonic nuances without using your eyes to see what you are listening to. You can't. You won't. Ask yourself why old bean.

 

no reason to be..... no worries.

I leave it up to the inidvidual to decide!

they would not prove anything....!

ie there would still be debate!

time/expense etc

Wih the UTMOST respect......you don't worry me!


(but your offer IS apppreciated! Thankyou very much!)

 

......isn't this a good question, Mike?



edit; so you look at an amplifier, then its spec, it impresses you, then you listen to it ....right?

ok.

...but I think theres rooom for both approaches!


Like I said above.....microphony is sufficiently well documented on the web to satisfy me that it IS an authentic topic.(+I think well documented)

I think in a sense I am comfortable with that...

 

Why is it that whenever the likes of cable salespeople and tweakers are offered the opportunity to put their beliefs to the test, they refuse to do so?

All I ask is that people making unsubstantiated claims back them up. I think that's a reasonable request. As I said earlier, there is a large jump from accepting that vibration exists to proving that it has an audible effect. A leap of faith if you like.

 

Mike, I told you!

approx 1 hour ago!

I haven''t had any cones back!

Very good feed-back actually!

If I'm honest I think this is questionable

...and yet, like I say its very well documented....





Why does this worry you, Mike?

Are you SO scientific you have to prove soemthing is fact?

OR

do you feel i'm trying dupe pople .......and you feel THATS wrong? (which it would be!)

 

Would you be so kind as to produce some of this documentation ? We've been asking for that since page one. Not just documentation showing resonance control, but it's audible effects as well. That should show that some proper research has been done.

That's super. All I'm saying is it would be interesting to see how they got on with people relying on their ears. I found that to be a quite interesting experience - that huge differences I thought I perceived in sighted listening more of less vanished never to reappear. Clearly if people can identify your cones or whatever using their ears alone, you are going to have a fairly special product which should really sell.

I guess I'm the kind of guy who, when someone says "product a reduces X and dramatically increases Y", simply wants to know "well does it really" and obviously if it does, then why? In the long term, I think that kind of attitude can save me and others a lot of money I can use to buy new music.

 

"Would you be so kind as to produce some of this documentation "


give me half a seccy...i'll try and get to you what i ws looking at last night

I have no doubt it won't be whwta you 're looking for ...but it was i meant.

 

"I guess I'm the kind of guy who, when someone says "product a reduces X and dramatically increases Y", simply wants to know "well does it really" and obviously if it does, "

fine....all to the good

your experiences have clearly drawn a blank....what a shame

you may just ahve to be happy that soemthings work for some people/soem systems.....


"then why?"


we know that, I think.....?


"In the long term, I think that kind of attitude can save me and others a lot of money I can use to buy new music."


I HAVE already said that I will return unwanted cnes/bearings??