Why is Zerogain going downhill?

I'm still deciding whether I'm going to overrule the poll because the result was incorrect

Michael.

 

As a newer member, I find some of the views and advice hidden away in the bitchfest helpful.

What I cannot understand is why several of the establishment seem so keen to spend so much time going over and over the same arguments. Why not go and listen to some music instead?

 

I only really ever post in chat and the music forums now. I have realised it is more fun spending money in a night club than spending the same money on yet another over priced interconnect that sounds 100% identical to your last one.

As far as my system is concerned everything works perfectly and it sounds great so I don't feel the need to save for a higher end system. Holidays, clubbing and perhaps not so wisely spending it on my computer seem more important.

The biggest bulk of my money has been spent on music though. I have bought more than £100 worth of vinyl records and £100 on CDs this year alone.

I still think the forum is good and there is a lot less sarcasim and bittering than a lot of forums.

 

I tried, but it wouldn't let me

 

The forum's not going downhill as such I think...kind of bumping along sideways really. There are a hardcore who make it seem a bit cliquey (If that kind of thing bothers you) and this occasionally leads to some polarizing of opinions, and equally a kind of 'gravity' ascribed to the comments of some, which may or mat not be well placed.

On the flip side the forum has a direct link to some interesting places, manufacturers, retailers and press rattle around here from time to time, which is kinda nice when done well.

Perhaps the new blood does tend to migrate to other forums, where it feels less overawed by the style and mannerisms of this one, it'll turn up here in due course, or go all AV/mp3 on us, confirming all our worst fears.

 

fllame wars aren't going downhill' imo,they are a dramtic improvement over the cosy little chats involving a few regulars

 

its not just at ZEROGAIN a few other forums i go to all end up having a flame war or a reasonably good topic ends up goin off topic very quickly.i recently was parcipating in meridian 506/508 topic and it ended up being a topic all about cheap cd players(toshiba,denon,etc) fed into dacs.

as for the industry its obvious now many are pumping the funds into AV which is fine if your into that, if your not it could be a frustrating time for you.Ive read some interviews with some reps and MD'S at some of the larger manufacturers and all are favouring the AV direction at present,which obviously they need to be seen doing to stay in business as probably the two speaker stereo world no longer can produce a profit on its own.
Its obvious to the general buyer(public) the philosphy of 5 speakers or more will sound better than two which is a shame and obviously a personal preference to those who have used the two speakers designs for many years.I personally enjoy the 5 speaker experience when it comes to watching a film but where listening to music its a 2 speaker design for me.
If we think about it manufacturers have had 40 years to design 2 speaker hifi
systems or components.I now think the 2 speaker hifi as peaked in its design and optimum performance which is why the direction is switching to AV .


As for Zerogain its still a good place to pick up good solid information and i find most topics are informative until someone half way down goes off topic .
it may be seasonal blues but the world of hifi is changing rapidly.


brian

 

This is one of the most honest comments, from an established ZeroGainer, that I have seen in a long, long time. ZeroGain needs new and different blood, newbies & oldies, if the forum is to function effectively. The original purpose of ZeroGain was a place for experienced hifi buds to hang out whilst newbies were black-balled if they attemped to join (okay, an exaggeration, but you get my drift.) That was a mistake. This stance has been watered down over the last year or so but it is not enough. Not even Audio Asylum has this exclusive attitude and all manners of posters are welcome as Audio Asylum know where they would be without diverse members with different experience levels and a wealth of new topics. This, I believe, is the point that WM is making.

As Lamboy has stated, I have also noticed that ZeroGain appears to have lost it's spark in terms of interesting topics to debate especially from established and long-standing members. They contribute to topics alright but don't start one up themselves.

Anyway, IF everyone now knows everything about hifi and there is nothing else to discuss, how about converting the hifi forum into a photography forum? I am now taking more interest in photography (especially digital) and discovering new things everyday and I'm sure the same will happen to some of the ZeroGainers that enjoy photography, have had enough of hifi and just want to focus on the music. Oh, the music forum should remain as it is.

P.S. I will now retire to the nearest corner and await my fate for making the above comments.



Enjoy the music,

Lawrie.

 

Without wanting to sound defeatist, have we not had threads like this before. And did they not state at the time that new blood was needed? And did we get any? Not as far as I can tell.

Every now and again a thread like this pops up, but nothing ever changes.

Edited to add: Actually though I think Lawrie has a good idea... how about expanding the forum to include other interests? It would stimulate more topics and would add diversity to the forum, I think that is an excellent idea. I am not that much into kit any more, I am now more into other things. How about it Michael?

 

Lawrie,

I wouldnt agree with your thoughts about Zg in its early days. I joined not long after the forum started, with questions. I had a very helpfull and friendly response at the time. I do understand what you say about experienced buds hanging out and chatting, but i felt they also freely offered advice aswell. The hardcore of ZG back then are still mostly present, and i think still offer advice.

The recent trend of threads degenerating into mine is bigger than yours is waring thin.
I think that maybe this puts people off the idea of starting new and interesting threads, as they soon decend into a repeat of the same.

 

What a strange reading of history. As I recall, Groovehandle was set up by Joel because the HFC forum was closed down for 2 weeks because of trolling, to give people somewhere to go. It was a success, and carried on. ZG was then set up by Michael when Joel decided to call it a day with GH. The perception that GH and ZG were anti-newbie was almost entirely promulgated by a few halfwits with agendas of their own.

-- Ian

 

Well, it is. My advice: get over it.

Man is a competitive ape, you see it quite a lot at traffic lights.

 

Sideshowbob,

With all due respect, there was was no perception, more like reality and who are the halfwits to whom you refer? The point about wanting a forum where established and experienced hifi experts could hang out was made in print by a few ZeroGain stalwarts who are still here today. IIRC, they did not want the newbie type questions about the likes Arcam, NAD, Marantz etc or which interconnects should I buy for my Cambridge CD and amp combo etc that seems commonplace on the HFC Forum. Cast your mind back my dear fellow or if the archives go far back enough, you will see the comments there.



Enjoy the music,

Lawrie.

 

Nicely put Ian.

As for AA, have you noticed the number of times newbies end up complaining that no one bothers to comment at all on their posts?

I suspect that a number of HFC regulars had their noses put out of joint when GH appeared suddenly and their peers set up a splinter group without their consent. This would help to explain the continuing stupidity seen elsewhere in relation to ZG.

The main problem IMO is that many posters here have been around long enough to become both opinionated and cynical about the whole hifi industry - a position that hardly sits well with newbies spouting enthusiasm for the latest superamp reviewed in What HiFi this month.

 

Merlins last paragraph makes mucho sense.

I still think the mine is bigger thing is not helping. The main protaganists know who they are im sure.
Lets all have a pint and a nice chat

 

You are not exactly helping with the chatty, friendly atmosphere, penance.

 

Which is the point I am making and has just been confirmed by the poster above - newbies vs experienced people. It was that way chaps and to a certain extent still is (although now watered down) and I believe that WM has been bold enough to state the obvious. It's a shame that others cannot see that and stop being defensive. Crisis? What crisis?

P.S. Again I await my fate.



Enjoy the music,

Lawrie.

 

Is Mr D talking to me?

Anyway, it seems most people are agreeing in roundabout ways, time to move on?
How i dont know though.

 

I thought the standard had gone up now you got some Naim users over here.