Records recently heard
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tones
compulsive cantater
RdS said:But my point is this: why German?
RdS, in the absence of Pe-Zulu, it's a German wordplay on the name of the leader of La Volta, Jürgen Hübscher. "Hübsch" is German for "pretty" or "cute", and "hübscher" is "prettier". The literal meaning of Pe-Zulu's sentence is "It was said that nothing nicer has been heard", but in the double meaning, it means "it was said that nobody heard Hübscher"!
Rodrigo de Sá
This club's crushing bore
tones said:
Ah! I did undesrtand the phrase - as well as your reply - but I did not recall the name of the leader. I learnt German when I was a boy, but in the absence of training I almost completely lost it. I can still read simple texts, especially if they are focuses in issues that have a vocaluraly that I know well.
I tried to come back to German later, and I did make some progress, but again, lack of need made me forget it again. I do not think I will learn it 're-again', but it is a pity, because the language is so beautiful.
But really, it is very irritating that one almost completely unlearns a language that one knew (not very well, but I could read and talk in German) just because English is so pervasive. I find myself loosing my French, too, and that is almost unbekievable, because I actually learnt it as a first language. It is odd that I can still speak Portuguese... Even the papers I write are in English.
So I'll shut up. The double meaning was, indeed, funny.
Dear RdS, to answer that question I have to listen to Christensen again. I have heard his AoF many times but his Clavierübung III only twice, the last time a couple of years ago. As far as I remember, it didn't impress me much, maybe I listened to it too few times.RdS said:
Regards,
RdS and Tones
I am notorious for making word-plays all the time. Usually they come in quick irresistible associations. I love to say sentences which can be understood in more ways, and most when these two or more ways contradict each other. Of course most often in Danish. But now and then in other languages. Sometimes it is too much, even for me.
This about forgetting languages you don´t use, happens also to me, actually my French knowledge is sadly detoriating. Concerning English this forum helps me to manitain my active abilities, even if I sometimes express myself a tad affected.
I am notorious for making word-plays all the time. Usually they come in quick irresistible associations. I love to say sentences which can be understood in more ways, and most when these two or more ways contradict each other. Of course most often in Danish. But now and then in other languages. Sometimes it is too much, even for me.
This about forgetting languages you don´t use, happens also to me, actually my French knowledge is sadly detoriating. Concerning English this forum helps me to manitain my active abilities, even if I sometimes express myself a tad affected.
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To baroque keyboard fans in particular,
A little more about Handel's first set of harpsichord suites (1720). Listened to the Anthony Newman set; both the harpsichord and the interpretation were not to my liking. The harpsichord sounded unattractive and he played much too fast and choppily, with little regard for the lyrical beauty inherent in these suites. Although not on the level of Bach's keyboard suites, these are lively and life-affirming pieces, and a proper interpretation, such as that by Blandine Verlet in her Astree set, truly brings out the beauty of these works. Newman, sadly, does not come even close.
However, on the opposite end of the spectrum, there is the CPO set by Ludger Remy, which was highly recommended by pe-zulu. This is the most imaginative and personal interpretation of these suites that I've yet heard. Every suite sounds new and fresh, even the (in)famous Harmonious Blacksmith sounded different. The seventh suite is magnificently interpreted. Although a touch mannered and studied at times, this is a superlative effort. The harpsichord is beautiful and the recording exceptional. One of the best recordings of Handel's 1720 suites. Thanks, pe-zulu.
Sophie Yates, in her third disc, gives a most vibrant and exciting performance. Less imaginative and more straightforward than Remy, she nevertheless plays with such propulsive drive that it's difficult not to be impressed and persuaded. In the fast movements, she excels and there is more lyricism in her slower movements compared to her previous two discs. She also includes some works from Handel's second set, played with similar aplomb.
All the best sets have something excellent to offer, Verlet with her unhurried, conversational and textured playing, Remy with a most imaginative and illuminating approach, Dantone with his thought-provoking and virtuosic set (his use of agogics coupled with lavish ornamentation and a great-sounding harpsichord make his set very appealing), and Yates, whose Vol. 3 is very thrilling and exciting, if a tad straightforward.
Regards.
A little more about Handel's first set of harpsichord suites (1720). Listened to the Anthony Newman set; both the harpsichord and the interpretation were not to my liking. The harpsichord sounded unattractive and he played much too fast and choppily, with little regard for the lyrical beauty inherent in these suites. Although not on the level of Bach's keyboard suites, these are lively and life-affirming pieces, and a proper interpretation, such as that by Blandine Verlet in her Astree set, truly brings out the beauty of these works. Newman, sadly, does not come even close.
However, on the opposite end of the spectrum, there is the CPO set by Ludger Remy, which was highly recommended by pe-zulu. This is the most imaginative and personal interpretation of these suites that I've yet heard. Every suite sounds new and fresh, even the (in)famous Harmonious Blacksmith sounded different. The seventh suite is magnificently interpreted. Although a touch mannered and studied at times, this is a superlative effort. The harpsichord is beautiful and the recording exceptional. One of the best recordings of Handel's 1720 suites. Thanks, pe-zulu.
Sophie Yates, in her third disc, gives a most vibrant and exciting performance. Less imaginative and more straightforward than Remy, she nevertheless plays with such propulsive drive that it's difficult not to be impressed and persuaded. In the fast movements, she excels and there is more lyricism in her slower movements compared to her previous two discs. She also includes some works from Handel's second set, played with similar aplomb.
All the best sets have something excellent to offer, Verlet with her unhurried, conversational and textured playing, Remy with a most imaginative and illuminating approach, Dantone with his thought-provoking and virtuosic set (his use of agogics coupled with lavish ornamentation and a great-sounding harpsichord make his set very appealing), and Yates, whose Vol. 3 is very thrilling and exciting, if a tad straightforward.
Regards.
Dear Sn66
Nice to hear, that you like the Remy recording, -we seem to share our tastes a lot. And you make me even more curious about the Verlet recording, which I think unfortunately is unavailable at the moment, and the Yates, which I have considered earlier, and now certainly shall order next. RdS have heard the Newman and writes, that it doesn't convince him, so nor would I expect you to like it. The only attraction of the Newman is the fact, that he, according to RdS, uses a copy of a period instrument with 16'in one of the manuals. I have resisted the Newman until now, and your words makes it still easier to resist it forever.
I have got Christophe Rousset's Harmonia Mundi twoofer with F Couperin, and it is immediately obvious, that he is the best advocat of Couperin, one can wish, matching the style perfectly and playing with great virtuosity. And now I am trying to find out, whether the music does anything for me or not. One of my attention problems with F Couperin is, that much of the music is rather homophonic, consisting of a melody with an accompaniment in broken chords.
Regards,
Nice to hear, that you like the Remy recording, -we seem to share our tastes a lot. And you make me even more curious about the Verlet recording, which I think unfortunately is unavailable at the moment, and the Yates, which I have considered earlier, and now certainly shall order next. RdS have heard the Newman and writes, that it doesn't convince him, so nor would I expect you to like it. The only attraction of the Newman is the fact, that he, according to RdS, uses a copy of a period instrument with 16'in one of the manuals. I have resisted the Newman until now, and your words makes it still easier to resist it forever.
I have got Christophe Rousset's Harmonia Mundi twoofer with F Couperin, and it is immediately obvious, that he is the best advocat of Couperin, one can wish, matching the style perfectly and playing with great virtuosity. And now I am trying to find out, whether the music does anything for me or not. One of my attention problems with F Couperin is, that much of the music is rather homophonic, consisting of a melody with an accompaniment in broken chords.
Regards,
Dear pe-zulu,
I, too, was actually more interested in the harpsichord Newman used (I have his recording of Bach's toccatas so I more or less expected furiously fast playing), but the sound was not very impressive at all. It reminds me somewhat of the harpsichord Andreas Staier used for this two-set Scarlatti recital, also made by Keith Hill, a somewhat dull and unsonorous sound.
In respect of Yates, I was uncertain after listening to her Vols. 1 and 2. A friend (a hardcore Handelian in all respects) strongly recommended her Vol. 3. The problem you may have with the set, after listening to Ludger's almost interventionalist reading, is the literal starightforwardness of her interpretation. However, even in the US, she is considered one of the premier interpretators of Handel's keyboard music.
I'm glad you like Rousset's Couperin and you are right in the music being rather homophonic; it certainly does not have the complexity inherent in Bach's suites. Couperin's music is actually very strange and can be very nondescript. Sometimes, they can even sound frivolous and irritating. Somehow, I like his music very much, especially his last book, which has a disillusioned and almost funereal sound about it. I myself am rather introverted and reclusive, so perhaps I identify with the themes of elusiveness and solitude apparent in the music.
Regards.
I, too, was actually more interested in the harpsichord Newman used (I have his recording of Bach's toccatas so I more or less expected furiously fast playing), but the sound was not very impressive at all. It reminds me somewhat of the harpsichord Andreas Staier used for this two-set Scarlatti recital, also made by Keith Hill, a somewhat dull and unsonorous sound.
In respect of Yates, I was uncertain after listening to her Vols. 1 and 2. A friend (a hardcore Handelian in all respects) strongly recommended her Vol. 3. The problem you may have with the set, after listening to Ludger's almost interventionalist reading, is the literal starightforwardness of her interpretation. However, even in the US, she is considered one of the premier interpretators of Handel's keyboard music.
I'm glad you like Rousset's Couperin and you are right in the music being rather homophonic; it certainly does not have the complexity inherent in Bach's suites. Couperin's music is actually very strange and can be very nondescript. Sometimes, they can even sound frivolous and irritating. Somehow, I like his music very much, especially his last book, which has a disillusioned and almost funereal sound about it. I myself am rather introverted and reclusive, so perhaps I identify with the themes of elusiveness and solitude apparent in the music.
Regards.
Holm Vogels Clavierübung III
Dear RdS
Vogel is much more accessible, more fluent, more transparent and less idiosyncratic than Christensen. I find Christensen somewhat difficult to access, this is true of his Orgelbüchlein as well.
Regards,
RdS said:
Dear RdS
Vogel is much more accessible, more fluent, more transparent and less idiosyncratic than Christensen. I find Christensen somewhat difficult to access, this is true of his Orgelbüchlein as well.
Regards,
sn66 said:
Dear sn66
Sounds as if I am a bit more extrovert than you, even if I often feel a desire to be alone, especially for music-listening, which I find to be a rather lonely matter, because the mental experience is so difficult to describe. We miss adequate words and most often comment formalia: Which instrument, which edition et.c.
Actually I feel, that I share music with others at most, when I make active music with them.
Regards,
bat
Connoisseur Par Excelence
This is actually very interesting - has anyone else heard it?
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A bit of a disappointment
http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Arts/Arts_/Pictures/2006/05/18/monteverdi.jpg
I bought this (Sorry, can't get pictures direct!: Monteverdi Vespers / King/ Hyperion) on the strength of a Gramophone review. My "other" recording (Parrott / Taverner Consort) I've had for nigh on 20 years. It's done me well, but I thought: time for a change, SACD, multichannel, Gramophone recommendation, should be a treat.
It's not bad, even quite good (though I think some of the intonation is a bit suspect at times) but it doesn't grab me (yet) like the Parrott. ... and what a missed opportunity with regard to the multichannel version. The rears merely add a bit of ambience. In almost all cases this would be laudable, but with Monteverdi's theatrical music, and St. Mark's in mind, surely more could have been made of this.
Oh, well ...
Edit
Ah! I've just followed the link to the article in "The Guardian" http://arts.guardian.co.uk/critic/review/0,,1777955,00.html
I wish I'd read it before: it seems they agree.
Gramophone says: "This is a recording that almost didn't get made. An expensive prestige project for Hyperion, until recently the company's very future was in doubt after a debilitating legal case. The label's fans worldwide have been sending in money, some of which went to fund the Monteverdi. And we can all be thankful. Because here is a magnificent account of the Vespers which finds Robert King in sovereign form. His players and soloists are uniformly superb although, as William Yeoman notes, the set's great advantage is the way the singers use the words as springboards for the emotion."
http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Arts/Arts_/Pictures/2006/05/18/monteverdi.jpg
I bought this (Sorry, can't get pictures direct!: Monteverdi Vespers / King/ Hyperion) on the strength of a Gramophone review. My "other" recording (Parrott / Taverner Consort) I've had for nigh on 20 years. It's done me well, but I thought: time for a change, SACD, multichannel, Gramophone recommendation, should be a treat.
It's not bad, even quite good (though I think some of the intonation is a bit suspect at times) but it doesn't grab me (yet) like the Parrott. ... and what a missed opportunity with regard to the multichannel version. The rears merely add a bit of ambience. In almost all cases this would be laudable, but with Monteverdi's theatrical music, and St. Mark's in mind, surely more could have been made of this.
Oh, well ...
Edit
Ah! I've just followed the link to the article in "The Guardian" http://arts.guardian.co.uk/critic/review/0,,1777955,00.html
I wish I'd read it before: it seems they agree.
Gramophone says: "This is a recording that almost didn't get made. An expensive prestige project for Hyperion, until recently the company's very future was in doubt after a debilitating legal case. The label's fans worldwide have been sending in money, some of which went to fund the Monteverdi. And we can all be thankful. Because here is a magnificent account of the Vespers which finds Robert King in sovereign form. His players and soloists are uniformly superb although, as William Yeoman notes, the set's great advantage is the way the singers use the words as springboards for the emotion."
tones
compulsive cantater
Monteverdi's Vespers is my very favourite piece of music and I even did a thread on it here once. I have about 6 versions. I haven't heard the King one (sounds interesting), but I do have the Parrott - and although it's nicely played and sung, to me it always sounds like a vaguely resuscitated museum piece, dusted off for our observation and edification.
To me, nothing touches the Gardiner "live" recording in San Marco, with Suzuki a close second. I admit it, I like the "grand" Monteverdi, as opposed to the "contemplative" Monteverdi, and as the Venetians liked their music grand, Gardiner just seems right to me. I know the purists hate it, but who cares? The DVD of the event is poorly filmed, but it's an interesting record of a unique event.
Time I had a new Gardiner - I think I've played all the pits off the old one.
P.S. Aha, here it is, for what it's worth:
https://www.audio-forums.com/as-rediect/showthread.php?t=31
To me, nothing touches the Gardiner "live" recording in San Marco, with Suzuki a close second. I admit it, I like the "grand" Monteverdi, as opposed to the "contemplative" Monteverdi, and as the Venetians liked their music grand, Gardiner just seems right to me. I know the purists hate it, but who cares? The DVD of the event is poorly filmed, but it's an interesting record of a unique event.
Time I had a new Gardiner - I think I've played all the pits off the old one.
P.S. Aha, here it is, for what it's worth:
https://www.audio-forums.com/as-rediect/showthread.php?t=31
I find the so-called "purist view" of the Monteverdi Vespers make a lot of sense to me. As Monteverdi's own title suggests, the Vespers were written for performing in princely chapels or halls, in other word, private consumption. (Did he forsee playback on home audio systems already? 
) Maybe that's why I always find the mandatory shifting between solo and choral "sections" in Rene Jacobs' or in Gardiner's "big band" versions jarring, since it is done arbitrarily and not in the score at all. To me, the "minimalist" recordings by Savall, Parrott, and above all from Junghaenel and Alessandrini will do nicely: the music simply flows more naturally and still sounds grand enough (say, compared to the later Selva morale) without the need of further sonic padding from a supersized personnel or an extrapolated orchestration.
) Maybe that's why I always find the mandatory shifting between solo and choral "sections" in Rene Jacobs' or in Gardiner's "big band" versions jarring, since it is done arbitrarily and not in the score at all. To me, the "minimalist" recordings by Savall, Parrott, and above all from Junghaenel and Alessandrini will do nicely: the music simply flows more naturally and still sounds grand enough (say, compared to the later Selva morale) without the need of further sonic padding from a supersized personnel or an extrapolated orchestration.
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tones
compulsive cantater
If you see the video, it's actually a very little band! In fact, it amazes me that it managed to make itself heard in San Marco.Masolino said:
Anyway, each to his or her own.
tones said:
The orchestra may be small (still far from on-to-a-part) the multiple choirs he used make it a sizeable "band." Gardiner does the same "soloist ensemble leading into full chorus" thing, too, in his recording of the Bach b-minor Mass, where the "concerto grosso" effect doesn't, however, seem as outlandish as it does in Monteverdi, who was in many ways still a late Renaissance composer in mentality.
tones
compulsive cantater
My favourite B Minor Mass recording! But then, you probably guessed that already.
