Bass or everything else? BIG LEAGUE dilemna

I'm not in the market for big money, so the Dyns are a swap for my Epos + £200, should I go for it. I'd LIKE to try sealed boxes - in fact, I can't help wishing I'd kept my old JPW mini monitors and stands from 1997 - on my lo-fi (well, Pioneer PDS-703, JVC amp) they were ACE. ESPECIALLY for £50 :)

Lee - they're on those hefty Sound Org stands (the ones the Epos' were on), on small pavers on top of coins (the pavers aren't totally flat so I had to put some coins under them to level them up!).

Sod a dog - I'm gonna take the Kytes off my AV rig upstairs and try them later, just for a laugh! I have another week to continue playing now btw - so that gives a bit more room for manouvre.

Lord - I'd rather have no bass than slow bass. Integrating a sub with either Elas or Kytes is impossible, unless you're loaded (Naim NSub, f/o big Velodyne etc). If I had that money, I'd get some Arrivas, Neats, or similar :(
 
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The ATCs are, I believe, VERY power-hungry, and would probably rip my sources to shreds (although that said, they might not be any worse than ES14s in this respect???).

The Dyns never had the bungs (their owner never had them when he got them second hand).
 
Curt,

Are your Dyn's doing fine in this regard? I.e. don't you experience any unwanted/uncontrolled bass regardless of the music that is playing?
 
Dom chuck some jey cloths and also try socks in the back of them and see how you get on.
Eric i get a smidge but i believe it to be a room node but its very minor indeed.
That rear port is a pain in the preverbial though its that whole trying to make small speakers sound bigger than what they are melarky.
In a small room where placement is difficult i would go for sealed box designs but saying that even some of them need space.
Dom i wreckon your Kit will drive the SCM 7's reasonably and for around £250 they are a bargain if of course they sound right to your ears.

Curt
 
This is always the problem with conventional passive "hi-fi systems": matching speakers to amplifiers to room. Go active, and take away a load of compromises at a stroke.

ATC 20As.
 
Thanks Curt.

I currently drive my 52SE with MF 308 integrated. Source is MF X-ray V3. With some tracks, bass acts sluggish and gets a little overwhelming. When switching to another CDP (MF CD pre), the sluggishness disappears and the response gets tight. Maybe the X-ray could benefits from longer break-in as it was purchased only two weeks ago. And it's a wonderful player for the rest.

I had two guys over yesterday, and one of them took his Contour 1.3 SE's along. I supposed we had to hide for their bass response but the difficult parts sounded smoother and appeared less obtrusive and more room friendly compared to that of the 52SE.

Each of room/positioning/equipment (Don, these polypropylene woofers need more then 90W at 4ohms or the current delivered commensurate to that) can or will be crucial, but as a compromise (my 22 m2 room doesn't allow for placement 1 meter out of any wall for best results) they also can unexpectedly behave well. Though this can be considered a rarity given the long-term experience suffered from this brand.

Don, I have mine resting on Dyn 2 Stands (filled out with bird cage sand, each weighing in 45 lbs) and separated by Soundcare spikes. This support is helpful when the sound is already good, but it won't solve any major room/equipment imperfections.
Good luck with your choice.
 
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lordsummit said:
How much would you get for your Epos's, just wondering what else you might get?
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...not a lot, unfortunately, as one of them has a battered cab, and I did a piss-poor job of retouching it! They're mechanically sound and sound pretty good, and I offered them for £100 to my colleague, should the deal go through (after all, I didn't pay a massive amount for them).

ATCs are just too damn matter-of-fact for my tastes - although Henryt's old 50As (NOT SL version) kicked arse with the right music :)

The Dyns were sounding a LOT better yesterday - and got even better when I finally grew some balls and did the disabling of the bias weight on my RB300 (what was I worrying about - it was a night and day upgrade - for 5 minutes of my time!!). The issues I now have are definitely room-dependant, as the bass was much more coherent last night :)

Oh - they're currently on my Sound Organisation Z1 stands (not mass filled. but on small paving slabs). DO you reckon the Dyn stands'd be £100 better??? ...as my colleague is willing to sell these seperately, and me, being skint, could do with maybe saving the cash - but if they're THAT much better...

I tried socks on Saturday and it sounded flipping awful - no bass and constipated mids. J-cloths sound like a plan - I'll get some from Poundland next week and see what's what.

Interestingly, the Dyns seem to sound better with the covers OFF - that's a surprise, bearing in mind my Naim front end and amps ;)
 
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Hi Erik,
I use the 1.3 mkII's, i tried the 1.3 SE's but the bass was much to strong due to that even bigger bloody port sounded like nightclub bass :D
I did a bit more listening last night and i definately just have a room node problem though still think the dyns are a tad strong in the bass.
As far as Dyns though they are very neutral/revealing and i reckon that your CDP may not have tight enough bass and the speakers are revealing this.
What cables are you using throughout your kit?

Curtis
 
Dom also consider using drinking straws to block the port, they can be cut to varying lenghts and angles (much like a real port) and may work better than blocking with cloths or socks, and are also pretty cheap.
 
Hi Curt,

I owned the 1.3 SE for a while and drove them with a MF 3.2 power amp, but like you had unwanted bass all over the place and finally sold them for that reason. (Wasn't aware though that its port size exceeds that of the standard 1.3 or 52 SE)
Also tried the 308 power amp on them (at home) and the bass tightened up completely, but this dynamic combo needed more headroom as a whole then I could give them.
But after what I heard this week I'm really regretting my decision to sell them off, as I didn't expect that the 308 integrated would make that much of a difference (in terms of driving capability) over the 3.2 power amp, while the room could still handle dynamic output.

I'm using Van den Hul cabling throughout the system (Mainstream PC, MC Gold IC, The Wind MKII speaker cable) as VdH mates very well with MF (in my opinion). But it will not compensate any components' (or speakers') bass flaws and might even do a good job to enforce this. I tried some different cabling brands over the years but lost out on musicality and naturalness then, so (still) stuck to them unconditionally.

I think you're right about the CDP but will wait some more as it improved quite a lot after the second week.
After that I will try to demo the 1.4 at home, as it seems that these are more refined and resolving in some areas than the 1.3 (SE).

What CDP and cabling do you have beside the Krell KAV 400I, and how big is the room?
 
ErikfH said:
Hi Curt,

I owned the 1.3 SE for a while and drove them with a MF 3.2 power amp, but like you had unwanted bass all over the place and finally sold them for that reason. (Wasn't aware though that its port size exceeds that of the standard 1.3 or 52 SE)
Also tried the 308 power amp on them (at home) and the bass tightened up completely, but this dynamic combo needed more headroom as a whole then I could give them.
But after what I heard this week I'm really regretting my decision to sell them off, as I didn't expect that the 308 integrated would make that much of a difference (in terms of driving capability) over the 3.2 power amp, while the room could still handle dynamic output.

I'm using Van den Hul cabling throughout the system (Mainstream PC, MC Gold IC, The Wind MKII speaker cable) as VdH mates very well with MF (in my opinion). But it will not compensate any components' (or speakers') bass flaws and might even do a good job to enforce this. I tried some different cabling brands over the years but lost out on musicality and naturalness then, so (still) stuck to them unconditionally.

I think you're right about the CDP but will wait some more as it improved quite a lot after the second week.
After that I will try to demo the 1.4 at home, as it seems that these are more refined and resolving in some areas than the 1.3 (SE).

What CDP and cabling do you have beside the Krell KAV 400I, and how big is the room?
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Hi Erik,
My room is 14ft by 27ft speakers fire down the room and there is a room node issue between 50 and 40 HZ so the SE's sounded all over the place.
Then again i never had the Krell then but still pretty sure it wouldn't make that much difference considering there is bass a plenty with the 1.3's.
I use the Classe CD-10 CDP and IC is Balanced Musicwave plus and speaker cable is Luminous Audio Synchestra Sig which is amazing.
Good luck on the bass issue

Dom as long as the stands you have fit the speakers and are heavyish i wouldn't bother with the Dyn stands.
I know what you mean about a constipated sound with socks just wanted to know if it cleared up the bass issues.
It will leave the bass lean though but Jeycloths let some air out and i have also been told stockings are a good method but dont suppose you have them hanging around unless you are a closet tranny :D

Curt
 
The Devil said:
Er, not really. Set-up, front end, and all that.

If you can get them for £300, as someone suggested, then go for it.
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If I had £300... ;) Actually, if I *had* £300 right now I'd blow it on a cheap weekend break or something :)

BTW - if EPos' were too matter of fact with my sources, just think what the ATCs'd do!?
 
I'm not entirely sure what "matter of fact" actually means, but I presume that it means that you think that there is some sort of problem with them. ATC make far better speakers than Epos: the sound you get out of any speaker will depend on set-up, the room, and the sources.
 
"matter of fact" to me means "let's rip apart anything other than an audiophile recording, especially if the source isn't a ££££££ one". I might be short changing the ATCs though, as the ones I *have* heard in shows etc have kicked arse, but all with £££££ sources ;) BTW - I agree re ATC V Epos, but there's a big difference between price and of course passive versus active...

You can't get an ATC pair the size or quality of ES14s for £150 including stands, after all... Now THAT was a bargain, even though ultimately they didn't end up working out totally perfect.

The Dyns were singing like canaries tonight - so I'm not worrying any more! Even Whitesnake's "Still of the night" on very worn vinyl for 50p was sounding great - nice!!!

Julian - kit build speakers eh? Tempting - one day! I LOVE transmission lines - my little Rega Elas are ace in the upstairs rig!
 
Dom Dyns are truly great speakers if you have the room.
If they are working for you they will be a treat.
If they are not they will be dogs
Let me know how you get on

Curt
 

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