The Devil
IHTFP
I started with Classical, didn't get into modern music until much later on.
cardas golden reference or audience Au24
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wadia-miester
Mighty Rearranger
The Devil said:
James, I did not lump them together as 'per say' this fact based on the clients preference for THEIR choice of music.
IN fact the most Risque' album in one collection is a Stevie Nicks job
I've yet to hear any humm dinger of a system play cohesive, insightive and imnvolving rythymic driven music.
Because a system can do the total 'top to bottom' extreme's is NO garantee it can play cohesive & involving music.
Any Visit to the sounds of music 'basement system' will testify to that.
Pehaps you should visit Titains and get a feel for real classical reproduction, then stick on 'Dazed and Confused' and compare to YOUR reference ATC system.
Please report your finding back sir, Titain is also an excellent host.
Stereo Mic, good points on systems synergys sir.
The Devil
IHTFP
I haven't been invited to Titian's, and it is a bit of a step.
FWIW, the ATCs were designed with Classical music in mind, and they rock, as you know.
FWIW, the ATCs were designed with Classical music in mind, and they rock, as you know.
Well now you are.The Devil said:
I would share your flight expenses..
PM me if interested.
PS: actually anybody is invited.
penance
Arrogant Cock
Shame i dont know much classical music!
why is it a shame?penance said:
In a few words this is the difference in sound requirements between classical and electronically made music. During a pop concert I never ever heard any feelings of "airy" or "open"-ness. More of something coming out from PA-electronics and which strains your years to their limits. No culture of details is needed. Oh well not really true but behond a certain level of details, it will be contraproductive.wadia-miester said:..., very open and airy, lots of 'sparkles in the corner
" Owww I can hear the piccolo in the top right corner, 47 rows back" type thing.
For classical music details are very important but
also in the same amount the feeling of compactness.
Very important is the "open" and "airy" feeling. This make one of the differences between "hearing a Hifi-system" or "being there" feeling.
wadia-miester
Mighty Rearranger
Titian,
Tis a very valid point you make. This goes back to my first paragraph in the earlier post about specific musical prefacences.
Lets go deeper into this. The live being there feel, I can generate most accurately.
For example a small intimate blues club say 120 people max, all those small details, the size of club prefermance, the room acoustics, the bands fourboils, I can capture with comsumate ease with a very real sence of being in the front rows of performance.
Yet when I've played these pieces of music on these 'Super systems' I loses the magic of the performers art? How so?
Quite simple really, The sound is stretched, spread across what seems like a football pitch, loses cohesion and focus and immursement (granted it sounds very pleasant and smooth, big in staging and depth, but no musical soul is evident, the performanced is washed over with presenational aspects. This may be benefical for certain styles of music but not for The Hoochie-choochie men
So where as have only a 8 foot wide 120 Piece Orchestra isn't cool, neither is having a 5 piece blues band made 24 foot wide, disjointed, unfocussed, devoid of impetious and involvment.
Striking a balance is the key to obtaining great sounds IMO.
Wm
Tis a very valid point you make. This goes back to my first paragraph in the earlier post about specific musical prefacences.
Lets go deeper into this. The live being there feel, I can generate most accurately.
For example a small intimate blues club say 120 people max, all those small details, the size of club prefermance, the room acoustics, the bands fourboils, I can capture with comsumate ease with a very real sence of being in the front rows of performance.
Yet when I've played these pieces of music on these 'Super systems' I loses the magic of the performers art? How so?
Quite simple really, The sound is stretched, spread across what seems like a football pitch, loses cohesion and focus and immursement (granted it sounds very pleasant and smooth, big in staging and depth, but no musical soul is evident, the performanced is washed over with presenational aspects. This may be benefical for certain styles of music but not for The Hoochie-choochie men
So where as have only a 8 foot wide 120 Piece Orchestra isn't cool, neither is having a 5 piece blues band made 24 foot wide, disjointed, unfocussed, devoid of impetious and involvment.
Striking a balance is the key to obtaining great sounds IMO.
Wm
I totally agree with you again. I also refered this in reports I wrote about systems I've heard last year at the heathrow show. These kind of bown up soundstages are not my taste because it takes me away from any reality.wadia-miester said:Titian,
Tis a very valid point you make. This goes back to my first paragraph in the earlier post about specific musical prefacences.
Lets go deeper into this. The live being there feel, I can generate most accurately.
For example a small intimate blues club say 120 people max, all those small details, the size of club prefermance, the room acoustics, the bands fourboils, I can capture with comsumate ease with a very real sence of being in the front rows of performance.
Yet when I've played these pieces of music on these 'Super systems' I loses the magic of the performers art? How so?
Quite simple really, The sound is stretched, spread across what seems like a football pitch, loses cohesion and focus and immursement (granted it sounds very pleasant and smooth, big in staging and depth, but no musical soul is evident, the performanced is washed over with presenational aspects. This may be benefical for certain styles of music but not for The Hoochie-choochie men
So where as have only a 8 foot wide 120 Piece Orchestra isn't cool, neither is having a 5 piece blues band made 24 foot wide, disjointed, unfocussed, devoid of impetious and involvment.
Striking a balance is the key to obtaining great sounds IMO.
Wm
Even in a live classical concert there is a certain size of soundstage of even a 200 piece big orchestra. It is always good to go back to a live performance to get the idea of what it "should" be.
Tones but please believe (even if you might haven't experienced it yet (?)) that not all 'Super systems' are like that fortunately.
On the other hand I cannot appreciate fully classical music played on a small soundstage, flat as a pancake and without "air" or "open"-ness feeling.
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wadia-miester
Mighty Rearranger
Titain,
I was not referring to show systems at all.
I use the term super system (Sorry I mean expensive) purely as tag nothing more.
Very few systems I've heard can genuinely 'put you there' a the heart of the performance regardless of $£$£$£.
One gentlemen I know has a system in excess of £500k, yes the figure is correct.
That did not include the custom built and designed room by a team for US acoustic engineers either.
Mindblowing it is, but yet ultimately soul destroying for me? Why?, I've yet to hear anything come even remotely come to its realism and true scale.
Yet once you get past the WOW this is utterly amazing factor, its well flawed.
Thats a big statement I realise given the huge sum of expenidure & attention to detail involved.
It just doesn't have that immursement, groove & captivating sound thing.
My point being is that if I wish to listen to Mahlars 9th at realistic levels, and be engrossed and captivated with the performers presenation in all its blood thirsty Glory, yet in heart beat be able to capature the Crowd bating dance of Blackmore and Gillian playing with 'Strange kinda of woman', to bonzo ploughing through Dazed and Confused in a totally cohesive and rock and roll way?.
Can it glue the elements of Eric Johnsonns 'Zap' together in the way they were written? As well as Portray Eva Cassiday's fields of Barley as delicately as they were sung?
I believe to obtain the best of both you need to custom build from scatch (IMO)
I was not referring to show systems at all.
I use the term super system (Sorry I mean expensive) purely as tag nothing more.
Very few systems I've heard can genuinely 'put you there' a the heart of the performance regardless of $£$£$£.
One gentlemen I know has a system in excess of £500k, yes the figure is correct.
That did not include the custom built and designed room by a team for US acoustic engineers either.
Mindblowing it is, but yet ultimately soul destroying for me? Why?, I've yet to hear anything come even remotely come to its realism and true scale.
Yet once you get past the WOW this is utterly amazing factor, its well flawed.
Thats a big statement I realise given the huge sum of expenidure & attention to detail involved.
It just doesn't have that immursement, groove & captivating sound thing.
My point being is that if I wish to listen to Mahlars 9th at realistic levels, and be engrossed and captivated with the performers presenation in all its blood thirsty Glory, yet in heart beat be able to capature the Crowd bating dance of Blackmore and Gillian playing with 'Strange kinda of woman', to bonzo ploughing through Dazed and Confused in a totally cohesive and rock and roll way?.
Can it glue the elements of Eric Johnsonns 'Zap' together in the way they were written? As well as Portray Eva Cassiday's fields of Barley as delicately as they were sung?
I believe to obtain the best of both you need to custom build from scatch (IMO)
