LCD PC monitors

Just a bit of an update here as I've now taken delivery of the 19 inch Dell CRT that Robbo suggested. It's really very very good value for the money and I'd recommend it to anyone wanting a CRT of that size and with only an absolute £110 max to spend. Howeverââ'¬Â¦ ;) , I still reckon a Trinitron CRT derivative is what I really really want, so have now placed an order for an Iiyama Vision Master Pro 454 (the most recent and now discontinued 455 model doesn't seem to be available at all anywhere now). The Dell I'd say appears to be missing just that last ounce of razor sharpness on text and edge definition as well as colour saturation that you get from a Trinitron/Diamondtron CRT. This Dell has to be one of the best (consumer?) shadow mask PC displays I've personally used though it has to be said.

I've also had a Sony SDM-HS95P 19 inch LCD on trial for the last few days and will be returning this for a refund forthwith. Considering this is Sony's top of the range 19 inch TFT I'm very disappointed, I just can't believe they've ceased manufacture of their Trinitron CRT range of monitors exclusively in favour of TFT. For them to justify this decision I'd have hoped that this was because their TFT's were at least able to match their Trinitron displays in every single area of performance but I'm not convinced that that is the case.

I've been driving the Sony via DVI (output from a Matrox P650 graphics card), installed the manufacturer's Windows INF monitor device file, and calibrated the display's phase and other settings using the set-up application provided on the supplied CD-ROM. Sure the image is very crisp and clear, DVI over analogue video input is a no-brainer, but I still have an issue with being able to see the backlight affecting certain combinations of colours, it's like being able to see a distracting translucent glow or visible aura effect under-imposed (is there such a word?). I also find the light produced by energy saving light bulbs or most fluorescent lighting to be very fatiguing to my eyes, looking at an LCD display (from close quarters) seems to have an equivalent type of effect for me.

Sorry, rant over! :D Regular scheduled programming will now be continuedââ'¬Â¦
 
Henry I am at a loss. Having had a couple of Apple LCDs I will never return to CRT.

Perhaps you should just check an Apple screen out, just to at least put your mind at rest you don't like LCD, if you don't like the apples LCDs you will never like LCD.

My 23 inch shows a really good white to black range and is pin sharp, no ghosting, no blurring and can be seen at a ridiculous angle. Its all digital though what ever difference that would make.
 
Perhaps some people have higher standards/want different things than you Gary!

It has to be said, while TFT monitors are very good at a lot of things, there are some areas (which Henry has highlighted) where good old CRT reigns supreme. It really depends on what your priorities are. I am in the same boat as Henry, my 21" Sony G520 has just packed up (took it to the tip yesterday :cry: ) and I really need to find a good monitor. I quite like LCDs for text work, but for things like photo-imaging, the Trinitron monitors are unsurpassed as the colour accuracy and contrast ratio is far better.

Henry, Sorry the Dell didnt do it for you. I assume you are going to be able to get a full refund?

Cheers, Robbo
 
Perhaps, perhaps.

Where you are perhaps in that line of work I would imagine you would want what comes closest to your final output.

Input has little well input in this regard as its the output stage you would have to worry about from the screens point of view. To put that another way, you have coloursync and what ever on PC, which helps but every professional and indeed amateur knows that it was only your eyes at the time of the photo which will ever give a real representation of what was recorded, from there on in its a whole set of comprimises.

I seem to get a very close match on output, this was especially so when Sheila worked at kodak and had free reign on some superb printer such as four pass and dedicated photo printers in the main building, in that regard the images we were getting were identical to the LCD, except that of course the LCD was physically brighter.

I am not arguing, however I also have high standards. A lot of the issues people complain about such as poor angled view, colours being wrong and ghosting I have never suffered, therefore my expectations and results have obviously faired better from others.

I do not necessarily believe this is because I have low standards, indeed I felt it was better to pay the extra (which I did) to get the quality result.

Of course if all you want to spend on the main interface with your work is £200 then you get what you pay for don't you?
 
garyi said:
Perhaps you should just check an Apple screen out, just to at least put your mind at rest you don't like LCD, if you don't like the apples LCDs you will never like LCD.

My 23 inch shows a really good white to black range and is pin sharp, no ghosting, no blurring and can be seen at a ridiculous angle. Its all digital though what ever difference that would make.
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Hi Gary ââ'¬â€œ if you have any particular model numbers for me to checkout then I will keep an eye out for them, but the only Apple TFT's I could find (which can be purchased separately rather than bundled with a computer) are the 20 and 23 inch wide screen models (don't need/want widescreen). £550 for the 20 inch version is more than I'm willing to spend on a VDU for my PC, if it were the only screen in the house than I'd not have any qualms. Having said that it would still be interesting to see what it can do.

Oh, I did do a bit of quick research earlier on the 23 inch model, a review I found says that you need to buy an external converter box in order to use it with a PC because it uses Apple's own proprietary digital video interface connector i.e. it's not the standard DVI-D type input that PCs (and most non bargain basement standalone DVD players) would normally use.

Other people I know that work in offices that do photo editing and graphics design work seem to rate NEC highly for LCD displays. I'd be looking to spend about £450 for a 19 inch from NEC, again a sum of money that would need exceptional justification to convince me to part with my hard earned.

Don't get me wrong, the Sony TFT I've got next to me on the desk at the moment actually has a sharper image especially on text than the CRT I'm looking at, it's just my eyes find it easier to focus on the CRT than the LCD due to the distracting backlight related issues which IME so far is inherent in LCD based screens. Primary or strong colours are very vivid on the LCD, but still seems more natural to me on the CRT.

Robbo said:
Henry, Sorry the Dell didnt do it for you. I assume you are going to be able to get a full refund?
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I think it's probably a case of once a long term Trinitron user, always a Trinitron user. I'm going to see how the Iiyama CRT that I ordered compares with the Dell. If I end up keeping the Iiyama then Dom has offered to buy the Dell off of me. If not, then I can live with the Dell quite happily until maybe SED technology becomes a consumer reality! :)
 
Robbo - could you not get that lurvely Sony serviced, before it went to "bongsklaaaash" land? (That's the sound of a CRT being bust, in case you were wandering ;)).

The Apple screens are actually slightly better than the NECs we use here at work - although whether that's because the Apple screens use digital links, and our Dell PCs use analog into the NECs is another question...

That Dell screen is excellent though - as Henryt says, it's not as sharp as a Trinitron, but it's not very far behind at all :)
 
Henry Apple keep it simple on the models, www.apple.com/ukstore And click on displays.

There are three, 20 inch, 23 inch and 30 inch.

If you have seen iMacs do not use this as a fair comparison, the dedicated screens are significantly better.
 
Robbo - could you not get that lurvely Sony serviced, before it went to "bongsklaaaash" land?
Click to expand...

Possibly, but I don't really feel that spending money on repairing a 4 year old monitor is a good use of resources. I would have thought than nobody would look at one for less than £100, so I think it is better putting that money towards a new monitor.
 
Ah, but £100 to keep a 21 inch Trinitron on the pace is a steal! My 1997 25inch Trinitron telly still gives out amazing clarity and peak whites - those Trinitron CRTs go on and on and on, unlike Ariston :)
 
Just taken delivery of the aforemetioned Iiyama Vision Master Pro 454 this morning and in summary I think this will be the last CRT display I'll ever own for my PC until I can find a non-CRT based display to replace it with. :banana:

There are a number of preset "picture quality" modes including text and picture/video. In the text modes you get the sharpest text/edge quality, whilst in the non-text modes you get a lot more brightness and colour contrasts are higher which suits DVD viewing or picture editing (although text quality isn't as sharp).

The built-in speakers, USB hub, and small foot print (for a 19 inch CRT) are also nice touches, but it's those familiar trademark Trinitron/Diamondtron traits that makes this one a keeper for me. :)

Will be making a trip up to London this weekend so will see if I can cast an eye over some Apple and NEC TFTs in Tottenham Court Road.
 
Good to hear your deleivery arrived today, so you'll not be sending any more monitors back then a? hehe :lol: That Dell you have isn't a bad picture really for a CRT.
 
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Henry you want to goto the apple store, Regents Street ideally. Or there is Micro Avika on The Court.
 
We went there the day it opened (we lived in Watford so no great shakes) we couldn't even get near lol.

I would imagine with the Nano out it will be equally rammed.
 
The Apple Centre was fairly busy, but not totally mobbed, considerng it was a Saturday afternoon. I like the way you can just swan around trying things out without a sales person breathing down your neck or instantly ready to pounce, but they're floating around and you can easily grab one at any time if you want. It's a very laid back vibe in there! :) Easily managed to get a decent amount of hands-on time with a system utilising the 23 inch wide screen TFT:

Dsc00027s.jpg


The viewing angle certainly is very wide, in fact I never had an issue here end of story. The back light was very non intrusive, the first time I've been able to say that about an LCD display, so blacks were certainly the best I'd yet seen from this type of display. My eyes got on with this display very well, no focusing or fatigue issues which is yet another first. Colours were good, but I think what was missing for me subjectively might have been resolved by the display having a glass front (like Sony's X-Black TFT screens do) instead of plastic which woud change the way light is perceived to emit from the display so that certain images look glossy (as they do on a CRT) as opposed to mat (as they appear to me to do so on most LCDs). I'd ideally want the 23 inch model rather than the 20 inch variant which I found a bit small in widescreen format. But twice the money for an extra 3 inches of display area, hmmm. Will be pondering over this for a bit longer, but yes "worthy of consideration" is the verdict! ;)

There was also a very tasty dual headed display set-up making use of two 30 inch widescreen displays, but OUCH you'd be looking at parting with £2k per monitor if you wanted to do this!!

Dsc00028s.jpg
 
Yes 30 inches, yum yum, you also need the very latest graphics card to run one.
God knows how they are running two, I know the ATI has two DVIs, but I thought the 30 inch needed both DVI ports, so my guess is two graphics cards at another 400 each. Ouch indeed.
 

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