NVA amps

RobHolt said:
Agreed, But aren't you curious to look at why there might be a difference ? I wasn't joking when I said that removing the case from the Accuphase made no difference. In the case of my pre amp it is unusable without it's steel case and sounds worse - but with good reason- the case greatly reduces the intrusion of RFI into the circuit.
The DNM comparison is interesting as his pre amp (and I beleiive hs power amps) are pretty bandwidth limited and less likely to suffer RFI problems.

Another phono stage I used a few years ago, from a designer firmly in the non ferrous camp, was so prone to RFI that it was laughable. Ultra wideband, high gain curcuit in a largely metal free case....... you see my point?
There are forces at work here, perfectly easy to measure and explain forces and there are others which require a degree of belief ;)
IMO, the screw issue goes firmly into the belief camp.

I think this is a good discussion and well worth having but preferably not now within this NVA thread given Richard's recent threat. It's also a little off topic by now :)
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I can assure it is not a threat! Anyone who wishes to continue with the discussion within this thread is quite welcome, including those who completely dissagree with me. But this virtual world is subject to the same rules and consequences as the real world. Commit slander as you have now done on more than one occasion in this thread and you take your consequences. I have never been concerned with people who dissagree with me. I object to those who have to resort to ad hominem as with the kid with the guitar, and I definitely will not accept unwarranted slander.

TonyL has got it about right and I couldn't do more than advice people to follow his thoughts if you wish to hear this effect. I am not sure who originated the work on non metalic cases, I think DNM and ourselves were working on parrallel lines about the same time in the early to mid 80's. I don't know of anyone prior to that. How does this happen, well you just need an open mind, where you always say "could be" instead of "can't". There are no absolutes in this world and the current state of the art leaves masses of possibilities.

Richard
 
Richard Dunn said:
I can assure it is not a threat! Anyone who wishes to continue with the discussion within this thread is quite welcome, including those who completely dissagree with me. But this virtual world is subject to the same rules and consequences as the real world. Commit slander as you have now done on more than one occasion in this thread and you take your consequences. I have never been concerned with people who dissagree with me. I object to those who have to resort to ad hominem as with the kid with the guitar, and I definitely will not accept unwarranted slander.

TonyL has got it about right and I couldn't do more than advice people to follow his thoughts if you wish to hear this effect. I am not sure who originated the work on non metalic cases, I think DNM and ourselves were working on parrallel lines about the same time in the early to mid 80's. I don't know of anyone prior to that. How does this happen, well you just need an open mind, where you always say "could be" instead of "can't". There are no absolutes in this world and the current state of the art leaves masses of possibilities.

Richard
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In light of your posts I'd prefer it if you didn't discuss this issue, or any other issue with me on this forum. I have no wish to discuss anything with you, or discuss your products further.
If you do have anything to say to me, or wish to issue further threats to 'pursue' me then please send me a PM and I'll gladly supply contact details, email etc. This discussion should not continue here as it is unfair to ZG.
 
Richard,

Can you please point out where Rob has committed slander? As far as I can make out he has only expressed his opinions or disagreed with you.
 
Dev said:
Richard,

Can you please point out where Rob has committed slander? As far as I can make out he has only expressed his opinions or disagreed with you.
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Lots of fringe ones but this is the one that got it serious.

ââ'¬Å"But ***pretending*** that changing or removing screws from a case will improve the sound of your products puts you into the same catagory as the magicians who constantly invent the perfect cable year after afer year.ââ'¬Â

My highlights.

Richard
 
RobHolt said:
In light of your posts I'd prefer it if you didn't discuss this issue, or any other issue with me on this forum. I have no wish to discuss anything with you, or discuss your products further.
If you do have anything to say to me, or wish to issue further threats to 'pursue' me then please send me a PM and I'll gladly supply contact details, email etc. This discussion should not continue here as it is unfair to ZG.
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I will speak to whom I wish, this is an open forum as long as I do not break the rules. You make your own choices in life, do not dictate them to me.

Richard
 
Richard Dunn said:
I will speak to whom I wish, this is an open forum as long as I do not break the rules. You make your own choices in life, do not dictate them to me.

Richard
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Indeed, but please do not speak with me here unless it is via PM.

If it makes you feels any better Richard, in the interests of accuracy, world peace and everyones blood pressure I'll gladly amend the sentence that has rattled you:

"But ***believing*** that changing or removing screws from a case will improve the sound of your products puts you into the same catagory as the magicians who constantly invent the perfect cable year after afer year, IMO."

Now go away and threaten somebody else.
 
RobHolt said:
Indeed, but please do not speak with me here unless it is via PM.

If it makes you feels any better Richard, in the interests of accuracy, world peace and everyones blood pressure I'll gladly amend the sentence that has rattled you:

"But ***believing*** that changing or removing screws from a case will improve the sound of your products puts you into the same catagory as the magicians who constantly invent the perfect cable year after afer year, IMO.ââ'¬Â

Now go away and threaten somebody else.
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As I said do not dictate to me. If you wish to make amends then a common apology and withdrawal, stating that what *you said* was not meant or was just a result of a little temper tantrum.

Until that point nothing has changed.

Richard
 
Richard Dunn said:
As I said do not dictate to me. If you wish to make amends then a common apology and withdrawal, stating that what *you said* was not meant or was just a result of a little temper tantrum.

Until that point nothing has changed.

Richard
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Jesus, you really do take the biscuit!

GO AWAY!

Never in over a decade of posting on audio BBs have I ever come accross quite a character.
 
RobHolt said:
Jesus, you really do take the biscuit!

GO AWAY!

Never in over a decade of posting on audio BBs have I ever come accross quite a character.
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In law refusing to apologise compounds the offence.

Richard
 
Richard,

I'll discuss this with other moderators, but I personally see nothing offensive or libellous in Rob's posts. Indeed he initially posted in this thread by expressing his pleasure at your return to business (see post#26).

Rob has also amended the wording that offended you, so perhaps we can now put this issue to bed.

If you or indeed any members feel a post is inappropriate, can we remind them we do have a report post facility. The moderation team will then act in the best interests of the forum.

The AUP specifically forbids personal attacks upon other members, and this will not be tolerated.
 
Sorry to say "pretend" implies a deciet or a lie, or a effort to defraud..

As I pointed out that I too have heard no screws effect and thus feel that by impication I could be being slandered in the same way ... I have no connection with NVA other than to have heard their amps many moons ago. I also have no problems with robs opinions... but not ascertions that others sincerly held beliefs are wrong, which by implication includes mine.

I'm certain a simple sorry from rob would close the gap, he can even say he thinks were wrong in his opinion......
 
It seems to me that Mr.Dunn is simply defending his products and voicing his opinion ..

I understand where Rob is coming from .. scepticism, but Mr.Dunn has made no outrageous claims or even pushed his products.. except to give advice about compatibility. Rob's disdain for the results of Mr.Dunn's research is rather rude and somewhat unfair - And as Mr.Dunn is still in the business of selling his products - is rightly concerned with being portrayed as a 'phoney'... Moreover, Rob seems a little concerned with getting the last word in .. hence his 'GO AWAY' comment .. but tenacity is the order of the day
 
Well, I think anyone who believes that removing a few screws from the casework of their amp will make it sound different is imagining it, it's all in their head, and no matter how sincerely they believe it they're talking nonsense. So, sue me, I'd love to see this phenomena proven in a court. Maybe we could do the same with cable debates, get a judge to finally decide whether cables with identical LCR parameters sound different. And, while we're at it, we could probably use the law to establish who has the best system in the universe too.

-- Ian
 
There's no need to bother the courts about that last question. Several commentators here have said that their system is the best in the universe, and who are we to doubt them. The only problem seems to be finding out who lives in this universe, and who in a parallel one - say, the Bizarro universe.



Richard (Dunn), if you had followed this board longer, you'd be more familiar with Rob's style. He is forthright in his opinions and statements, but he takes as good as he gives. I don't think he meant to slander you.
 
sideshowbob said:
Well, I think anyone who believes that removing a few screws from the casework of their amp will make it sound different is imagining it, it's all in their head, and no matter how sincerely they believe it they're talking nonsense. So, sue me, I'd love to see this phenomena proven in a court. Maybe we could do the same with cable debates, get a judge to finally decide whether cables with identical LCR parameters sound different. And, while we're at it, we could probably use the law to establish who has the best system in the universe too.

-- Ian
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You see this is part of the problem, people don't read posts or seeming don't have the intelligence to understand the implications.

There is no dispute over his disagreement with the hypothosis that using screws creates a sonic difference. I accept his opinion and I accept yours, that is what is known legally as "fair comment". What I object to is the implication that I am a fraud. That implies that even I do not believe screws have a sonic effect and that I am making it up for marketing or other reasons. That is unacceptable and libelous.

I refer those interested http://www.urban75.com/Action/libel.html

Richard
 
Richard Dunn said:
You see this is part of the problem, people don't read posts or seeming don't have the intelligence to understand the implications.
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Stop acting the arrogant arsehole. I'm well aware of why you're upset and why you think you've been slandered, I'm capable of reading. I was trying to leaven things with a bit of humour, something you might have been able to spot if you had either a sense of humour or a sense of perspective. From this point on you're on my ignore list. People who arrive on a forum and immediately start threatening to sue people for the smallest slight rarely prosper, and rightly so. You're only the second person I've ever felt the desire to ignore.

-- Ian
 
Thats trouble with posting .....people can't see your expression hence the use of the icons.....

its easy to say after the fact ...oh I was only joking !

oh it was a humourous aside ......

but unless you apply the icon in the first place ...... its no wonder people get the wrong end of the stick.

As to people just arriving on the forum ....you should treat them in the same way, as you would expect to be treated in return. As to threats to sue, in this case, IMO, when you imply someone is a fraud what do you expect ? That goes for if its there first post or there 10000.

I'm not siding with anyone its just common sense. Also remember what goes around comes around!

You may or may not know that abusive language is strictly frowned upon on this forum ....IMO your "Arrogant A******" falls squarely into this box......I would suggest that if you are insofficiently eloquent as to be unable to express yourself without resort to such inflamatory language....go post eleswhere.

This of course is IMO.
 
Rob....thanks for the ammendment .... I had not noticed ...so my appologise if I wrote before you had ammended.
 
Um, I thought Ian's post was funny even without the smilie icon.

(insert "chill out" icon here)
 


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