The future of loudspeaker systems

Originally posted by Lt Cdr Data
Steve, I have just acquired some single driver jordans, and they seem quite directional, no xover, could you shed any light?
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Are you using them singly or in an array? What is their diameter? Are they in a horn or what?
Graham C
The simple answer is a 3 way, with a wideband mid driver covering the sensitive bits.
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Yes, that can be a good answer, particularly when the mid driver goes a fair way up and down.
wadia-miester
A serious savaging from Mr 7v there :eek: they must be good :lol: :lol:
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Yup, no more Mr Nice Guy.

My therapists and business analysts have been getting together and they tell me I must increase my ratio of 'flaunting it' to 'having it'. :D
 
Originally posted by Graham C
The problems with crossovers have been vastly overstated IMO. .... The simple answer is a 3 way, with a wideband mid driver covering the sensitive bits.
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Precisely what ATC do, with the mid driver covering 350 Hz to 4 kHz.
 
Yes, sorry James, got my logic wrong.

You really should hear some NS10's. It really will make you wonder how they still manage to make many productions sound good. As Tom said, they became a bit of a standard and (travelling) engineers knew their sound. In fact the theory is that badly engineered stuff is produced in studio's with decent speakers because they still make the same adjustments they would for the NS10's.
 
Hi Steve, they are used singly in a 4 litre sealed box. Sound pretty superb. Take a little getting used to, but great detail and coherence.

I think they are the jx92s, bout 4 inchers

now I see why you use an array, vertically, they do go dull quite quickly.
 
Nice, and a good price.

I'm trying these at the moment
jens1.jpg

which use the Fostex FE103 driver. Shame they sound crap.
 
Originally posted by LiloLee
So what does the Active Filter you use do then?
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It acts as a low-pass filter for the bass speakers. It's the full-range speakers that are used without filtering.

I would have liked to have designed the bass speakers without filters as well but, unfortunately, the bandpass designs that I've tried don't sound anything like as good as a sealed box or transmission line design.
 
Originally posted by Lt Cdr Data
I think they are the jx92s, bout 4 inchers

now I see why you use an array, vertically, they do go dull quite quickly.
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Not sure about using the JX92 in an array. I have read that you get comb-filtering and a somewhat uneven treble which changes as you move your head because the drive unit centres aren't close enough together at the higher frequencies for them to act as a line source. There's more about it on the Jordan website and other places. The JX53 is suitable for an array if you mount them close together but they only go down to 150 Hz so you'd need a good sub.
 
So if they are Full Range speakers, why do they need a bass speakers?
And contrary to what you said you do use filters?
And guess what site this came from?
The egg-shape is machined at an angle that reflects the medium and high frequencies downwards and away from the drive-units.
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Probably in much the same way as NHT use their baffle shape.
 
Originally posted by LiloLee
So if they are Full Range speakers, why do they need a bass speakers?
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Why do any speakers need a sub? Are they not full-range?

I choose to position my full-range speakers away from walls because I prefer the sound that way. Used in this way, the bass speakers are mandatory, even though Mr. Messenger measured some bass response to below 20Hz. If I positioned the speakers against the walls, additional bass speakers would be an option but not a necessity.

As a matter of fact, I have some 'panel' speakers on the drawing board which are designed to be mounted on walls (anyone visiting me can hear a prototype single driver system in my kitchen). Even with just the single driver per side, a bass speaker or sub is not essential. With the larger systems that are in the pipeline - 2 or 4 drivers per side - I suspect that most people wouldn't use a bass speaker at all.
And contrary to what you said you do use filters?
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I have always told the truth which is that my full-range speakers don't use filters. As I told you, the bass speakers are filtered.

Please point out exactly where I have said anything contrary to this.
And guess what site this came from?
The egg-shape is machined at an angle that reflects the medium and high frequencies downwards and away from the drive-units.
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Probably in much the same way as NHT use their baffle shape.
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I don't have to guess Lee, that's a quote from my web site. What is your point and what on earth has it got to do with the NHT baffle shape?
 
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Whooaa Skank Buddy:eek:

I detect nasty negative vibes this day, what's up? Still "Waiting for your man"?

Digital crossovers are just so flexible (I used a 100th order one with my Tact setup), that they seem to represent a genuine advance over most commercially available boards. Every speaker designer I know (with the exception of you good, if slightly grumpy self) is feverously working away on the technology at the moment.

As for the profiling of the baffle, well it is profiled:D
 
Originally posted by Lt Cdr Data
Hi Steve, they are used singly in a 4 litre sealed box. Sound pretty superb. Take a little getting used to, but great detail and coherence.

I think they are the jx92s, bout 4 inchers

now I see why you use an array, vertically, they do go dull quite quickly.
Click to expand...
The dispersion pattern of 4" drivers will tend to be a little beamy at the high frequencies, so you'll probably have to listen on axis to get a decent treble. I'm sure you're already toeing them in to minimise the problem and you may well find that the benefits in terms of coherence and musicality easily outweigh the disadvantages.

If the cones were smaller in diameter they would have a wider dispersion but not such a good bass.

As technobear says, a vertical array would actually make the treble response worse as you come off axis vertically, due to combing and cancellations. My speakers use 2" drivers. I use four of them in a vertical array but mount them as close together as I can to minimise cancellation at the high frequencies. Even then, you really have to sit down to listen to the speakers properly.
 
Originally posted by merlin
Whooaa Skank Buddy:eek:

I detect nasty negative vibes this day, what's up? Still "Waiting for your man"?

Digital crossovers are just so flexible (I used a 100th order one with my Tact setup), that they seem to represent a genuine advance over most commercially available boards. Every speaker designer I know (with the exception of you good, if slightly grumpy self) is feverously working away on the technology at the moment.

As for the profiling of the baffle, well it is profiled:D
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Meaning good-natured me? :MILD:

I am looking into Class T and digital filtering for future Little Awesomes.

I also had a man come round today to discuss and demo his patented 'layered sound technology'. We tried a 'layered sound' version of the Nonsuch speakers and it was amazing, very interesting indeed.

Well, I just thought I'd mention it.

And yes, the NHTs are profiled, very pretty and probably sound great. Their use of the words "Baffle shape optimizes dispersion characteristics of drivers to provide smooth frequency response on axis and off axis." rattled my cage, is all.
 

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