Turntable recommendations: £300-500 (sans arm & cart)

Joe said:
The LP12 I heard beaten was an unmodded version with a Basik LVX arm, comparable in price to the Roksan Xerxes with RB300 arm it was A/B'ed with.
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If you are comparing two turntables, it is obviously essential that the arm & cartridge used on both are identical. The RB 300 is a much better arm (IMO) than the Linn Basik LVX.
 
The Devil said:
If you are comparing two turntables, it is obviously essential that the arm & cartridge used on both are identical. The RB 300 is a much better arm (IMO) than the Linn Basik LVX.
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Maybe, but the dealer insisted that the LVX was a better match for the LP12 than the RB300. I was just a clueless n00b wanting to buy a quality turntable, so I didn't argue the point with him.
 
if it wasmy money.. id search out a nice condition systemdek IIx900 minus arm.

its a great suspended deck.. parts are easilly available from audio note.. and it is in most ways identical in every way to the audio note TT2.

also it'll cost you no more than £150.. you can save a fortune.

thats the route i'll be taking when i move on from my rega planar 2.
 
Can't see why a rega shouldn't work on an LP12 anyway, neither of them has anything much to go wrong, when I've heard them together it just sounded like an LP12 to me, no obvious differences with the rega on there.
 
Anex said:
Can't see why a rega shouldn't work on an LP12 anyway, neither of them has anything much to go wrong, when I've heard them together it just sounded like an LP12 to me, no obvious differences with the rega on there.
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Well, there you go. This was a Linn dealership, but they also sold Rega stuff. Presumably they had their reasons for preferring an LVX to a Rega on an LP12. Maybe an armboard availability issue?
 
Probably laziness: they couldn't be bothered to switch the arms over. The RB 300 works very well indeed on an LP12, and most other decks, too.
 
The Devil said:
Probably laziness: they couldn't be bothered to switch the arms over.
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Quite possibly, though they certainly worked up a sweat carting loudspeakers in and out of the listening room the time I was A/B-ing speakers there (this being at the height of the 'single speaker demonstration' campaign).
 
If youre looking for a garrard without the tears, I'd buy a used motor unit from e-bay, and then contact lorricraft who will service it, check it over, mount it properly in a good plinth. Job done.

Lorricraft pretty much ARE garrard these days, so the above is a hastle free route to no problems.

Other than that, I'd say if you buy used from a reputable dealer, you will have come-back if there is any fault with the deck.

At £500, its either used high-end, or new mid-range. Im sure both would get you good sounds - but from a VFM and re-sale point of view its got to be used hands down.

Up to you though :)
 
The Devil said:
If you go for the Garrard, be sure to wear high-waisted trousers, and join the Tory party or Freemasons or preferably both.

;->
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And stock up on Sarah Brightman records!
 
I'm curious - could someone give a rough impression of the Garrard "sound"? Anything stand out, or basically neutral? It's just prejudiced but the things look very old fashioned so in my mind I'm imagining them sounding old-fashioned (in a soft, warm 'n woolly sort of way)...... Care to shatter my preconceptions? How does a well sorted Garrard square up to, say an LP12, or an NA Interspace?

Dynamics? Resolution? Bass (quality & quantity)? Refinement? Treble sweetness? Tonality..? All that good stuff.

Dunc
 
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a subjective description of sound in words? I'll 'ave a go guv!! Im sure I'll get jumped on though..

1) N/AS - big heavy platters and low torque motors. Strengths are pitch stability and bass. Detractors say they sound 'slow'. This is at counterpoint to their strenght of pitch stability...

2) Garrard. - effectively direct drive, built like a tank. Pitch stability again is good. Bass is good too. Id describe the sound as 'solid' (?) meaningless term perhaps but it springs to mind. Detractors point to the appearance, the fact that garrard aren't around any more. Sound wise, well, I suppose detractors might say it lacks excitement, but since Im not a detractor thats hard to say.

3) LP12. Ivors bouncy classic. I've heard these sound great. Sound wise they are described as pacey or lively, or fun. Detractors point to the age of the design and say that pitch stability isnt as good as more recent designs.


My conclusion is that they are all very good really, and you'd have to come to a pedant's nest like a hifi forum to meet nit-pickers!
 
I've never noticed pitch stability problems on any LP12 I've heard, and I've listened to at least eleven different ones at length.

The LP12 is said to be very good at "pace and rhythm", and measures very well wrt speed stability.

I haven't heard NA nor Garrard, but they are well-regarded by people I trust.
 
I haven't heard NA nor Garrard, but they are well-regarded by people I trust
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Bearing in mind previous references to height of waistes and your professional status, should that have read 'trussed'?
 
Last year's upgrade from Rega P25 to NA Interspace HD (secondhand) was surprisingly and gratifyingly HUGE in terms of quality difference. NAS TTs are easy to set up, well made and easy to run, they also sound fantastic.
You would not be disappointed if you ended up with a Spacedeck. After a Rega it would be something of a revelation.
 
The Devil said:
I do have to laugh when people say "such-and-such beats the LP12". As you know, the LP12 can be upgraded into very rarified territory, but these people never comment on the spec of this supposedly-beaten LP12...
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Not sure if your comment was aimed at me. I did state that the decks were between 77 & 04. The 04 version had a serial number of 944??, I don't think there has been many mods for the last 18 (ish) months, it was complete with a wide case Lingo (and an Armegeddon copy). An Itokk III was fitted, later an Ekos, I also tried an ARO.

The Technics SP 10 was superior at all aspects of reproduction.

The Devil said:
If you are comparing two turntables, it is obviously essential that the arm & cartridge used on both are identical. The RB 300 is a much better arm (IMO) than the Linn Basik LVX.
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I agree totally, I also admit that it is something I never did. The LP12 was fitted out as stated above. The SP 10 used to compare was fitted with an Alphason HR 100 MCS.

Comparisson was made with the same Kotesu Red fitted to both. The SP 10 was my preference by a wide margin.

It is the first time I have been without an LP12 for over 25 years.

Ken
 
Eep, Spacedeck a bit dear - 2nd hand Interspace maybe, but only if I happen to find one (they're not exactly ubiquitous...)

Anybody spotting an Interspace going for, say £500-550 or less PLEASE let me know ASAP!

Ditto Horizon SE (tho wouldn't really want to spend more than 350 or so for one of these). Anyone comment on the difference between Horizon/SE and Interspace? Is it huge or subtle..?

I must admit, out of everything suggested so far I'm most keen on the NA decks (Interspace primarily, but may be a bit wishful thinking - the Horizons look very cool as well). They're a bit on the ugly side (certainly compared to a P25 or LP12 in good nick) but they look serious - very well-made and purposeful. And personally (again just prejudice I'm sure) I like the idea of high mass turntables over spring-loaded ones... Springs just scream "resonance" to me..!

Anyway, think I might see if I can take home the Pink Triangle Export this evening and have a play over the weekend, see what I think. Will keep yas posted.

Thanks again for all the input - most illuminating!

Dunc
 
dunkyboy said:
I'm curious - could someone give a rough impression of the Garrard "sound"? Anything stand out, or basically neutral? It's just prejudiced but the things look very old fashioned so in my mind I'm imagining them sounding old-fashioned (in a soft, warm 'n woolly sort of way)...... Care to shatter my preconceptions? How does a well sorted Garrard square up to, say an LP12, or an NA Interspace?

Dynamics? Resolution? Bass (quality & quantity)? Refinement? Treble sweetness? Tonality..? All that good stuff.

Dunc
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The Garrards perhaps do sound a little old fashioned in a way, they usually suffer from a treble roll off, from about 14K upwards iirc, motor noise I think. BUT the bass is something else, possibly some of the best bass out of any TT and the midrange is excellent too which gives you an extremely musical performance, you just don't get the fidelity of modern decks. You'd get better highs from a NAS but not the same sound.
LP12s are similar in a way, imo their bass is pretty awful really and they don't have the same top end as a modern deck, but, like with the Gar's they do the important bits really well so can be very addictive. I've only heard a space deck from the NAS range, like Bottleneck said, they too have excellent bass and go much higher but lack the certain je ne sais q'uoi of the other two. They do come extremely close though and don't need oiling every few weeks like the garrards. TBH I think you'd have to listen to them all to really make a decision (or understand what I'm blabbering on about)
 

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