Seventh Veil

[merlin]

Agreed Tony,

It's great to see a company putting so much work into the aestetics of the speaker, quite like the look of the Osprey myself, now of only they did a top end standmount with the 9500 and Scanspeak 7"

What finish you gone for?

 

[wadia-miester]

Mike, where I'm moving to, Aestetics will play a greater part, a more homely and inviting atmosphere will be in the next Listening room (rather than the bachlor pad thang man!) so I've gone for the Pennsylvania Cherry, with custom cedar wood side 'flashes', and a 'gentle red' twin line adorning the front.
I don't believe Mr Mc ginty has produced a pair of stand mounts in a long time, shame really as I feel it would open up a whole new area for those wishing to accquire a truely good sound at a fair price. Tone

 

[7_V]

Originally posted by merlin
My current sub can only be crossed over at up to 120hz, due to it's filter.

The new subs, using JBL 15"drive units will be able to cross over at anything up to 800hz, and still be well below break up, although the plan is to experiment with anything from 100hz up to 325hz to avoid lobing. Being able to crossover at say 200hz should improve the power handling of the Bandors.

We can set the slope at anything from 2nd order to 10th order, all dsp generated of course. We can of course just set a low pass for the subs, and leave the satellites alone. Experiment is the order of the day.

Hi merlin

I wouldn't want the sub to go any higher than 100Hz. Actually, it wouldn't do much to improve the power handling of the Bandors, they'll fry before they reach their excursion limits, but it might make the sub position detectable.

Leaving the full-range speakers alone sounds good to me but sure, we can experiment.

Looking forward to it.

 

[technobear]

Originally posted by 7_V
Is that Castle Acoustics that was born out of Wharfedale? One of their directors, John Collinson (now retired), worked with me on measuring my old System IVs. Really nice man who developed one of the first PC-based measuring systems for loudspeakers.

Yes, they are Castle Conway 3s all the way from Skipton in Yorkshire. They are fantastic speakers. Very open and transparent. Very dynamic. Very articulate and powerful bass. Smooth treble. Plenty of punch and thwack. Castle needs to work on its dealer network so that more people get to hear these fine loudspeakers. Anyone who listens to rock will adore the Conway 3.

Chris

 

[merlin]

Originally posted by wadia-miester
Mike, I've gone for the Pennsylvania Cherry, with custom cedar wood side 'flashes', and a 'gentle red' twin line adorning the front.
Tone

You TART:notworthy :notworthy

Never took you for a changing rooms kinda guy

Well the plan for the subs is to finish them in Buffalo Hide, with solid cherry end cheeks, based on dear old Sonus Faber but with the ability to produce quality bass below 60hz

Have you heard the Blue Herons yet Tone Only reason I ask is that scany ring radiator

 

[wadia-miester]

Yes, there good Mike I do some some one who has a pair, I've only heard one of two pairs of speakers, do what they do, the other being Egglestone works Andra II's. WM

 

[merlin]

Originally posted by 7_V
Hi merlin

I wouldn't want the sub to go any higher than 100Hz. it might make the sub position detectable.

Steve, you need to throw that one out of the window too

I can run subs much higher than that without them being detectable, something to do with clever programming Seriously, what are you doing on AA asking about Par Eq for, they know so litttle over there it's laughable.

 

[7_V]

Originally posted by merlin
I can run subs much higher than that without them being detectable, something to do with clever programming

Now that, I'd find very interesting.

Seriously, what are you doing on AA asking about Par Eq for, they know so litttle over there it's laughable.

There's a chap who posts there called "Richard BassNut Greene" who has strong opinions on bass (like someone else we know ). I was hoping to draw him out and read his comments.

Did you read my post about psychoacoustics there? It was ignored, although I think if you read it carefully, you may find something in it. Steve raves on about room psychoacoustics in the asylum

 

[wadia-miester]

Ether that steve or the all knowing 'Bee keeper' aka Nic Rhoads or could that be test tone
A few followers here consider him to be in the 'were not worthy sector', however he again is knowledgable in this area, and you may benefit from his input, he usually hangs out in that 'Class area' AV forums. Though the one guy that matters never posts, but then he doesn't need too WM

 

[lowrider]

Hi Steve,

I did post there, without comments too...

I don't hear any problems with digital eq, first with TAG's TMREQ, now with Krell Showcase...

And, as I said in AA, there are measurable differences changing position in the room, but overall I get improvements across a wide listening area, i guess it could be different with other speakers / rooms, I have SF EAII, and I only eq low bass...

 

[merlin]

Originally posted by 7_V
[BDid you read my post about psychoacoustics there? [/B]

Yes thanks for that, psychacoustics play a much larger part in the success of a system than most realise, and by definition, this means that understanding the interaction of the brain/ear interface and the room's boundaries is of paramount importance.

I believe that you will find that the reason behind the 250hz selection is to do with the arrival times of room reflections, but to go into that further would probably bore the arse off WM & all

Just food for thought.......guess what percentage of the sound you hear from the system comes directly (ie accurately) from the speakers

 

[wadia-miester]

Originally posted by merlin

Just food for thought.......guess what percentage of the sound you hear from the system comes directly (ie accurately) from the speakers

55% (very rough guess)

 

[7_V]

Originally posted by wadia-miester
55% (very rough guess)

The precise percentage will depend on the diffraction and dispersion characteristics of the speakers.

Of course, the direct sound reaches the ears quicker and this gives it an increased significance.

Is the answer 42?

 

[penance]

Originally posted by 7_V

Is the answer 42?

ask the mice!

 

[merlin]

Originally posted by wadia-miester
55% (very rough guess)

Very good guess I'd say (although I'd go even lower in a typical domestic enviroment)

So only half what you hear is on the recording and the other half is trying to screw it up Compounding this is the affect of slap echoes and comb filtering, selectively removing and enhancing parts of the spectrum.

Sounds bad Actually it ain't that bad, provided we attend to the dispertion characteristics of the transducer, and we insure that the direct signal arrives before the 1st reflection, the ear/brain interface is pretty good at making us unaware of these inaccuracies.

Below 250hz however is a different story. In your average room, reflections start to arrive a few milleseconds after the initial sound (the Tact can show this). For LF sounds, whose period is longer than the time it takes for the first reflections to arrive, the reflections arrive before even one cycle is completed. By the time you've had a few cycles at low frequencies, the information you are hearing is a complete mess of standing waves, making it impossible to accurately position bass notes, and blurring the pitch beyond recognition.

Steve should note however, that Par Eq cannot correct for this state of affairs, it can only selectively attenuate those frequencies whose energy is multiplied by the propagation of standing waves. It cannot however allow you to hear the original waveform more accurately.

 

[7_V]

Originally posted by merlin
Steve should note however, that Par Eq cannot correct for this state of affairs, it can only selectively attenuate those frequencies whose energy is multiplied by the propagation of standing waves. It cannot however allow you to hear the original waveform more accurately.

Have no fears merlin. Steve is here with his notebook.

Maybe really serious audiophiles should live in an acoustically transparent tent in the middle of a large field - sort of a 'New Age Audiophile Traveller' thing.

 

[merlin]

Originally posted by 7_V
Maybe really serious audiophiles should live in an acoustically transparent tent in the middle of a large field - sort of a 'New Age Audiophile Traveller' thing.

Sort of depends really.

If the definition of an audiophile is to accurately reproduce what is recorded on the media of their choice, then they are for want of a better expression "pissing in the wind" with their valve amps, tweaky cartidges, and flooby dust:duck:

Of course, if you are a music lover (all the best people are you know ), then it's purely a matter of personal taste, although there will always be those without taste entirely

 

[merlin]

Originally posted by penance
ask the mice!

I did Penance I did

They were to shy and so I asked the sheep.......they just recommended Naim, Arcam and Chord

 

[7_V]

Originally posted by merlin
I did Penance I did

They were to shy and so I asked the sheep.......they just recommended Naim, Arcam and Chord

So you did try the field thing then.

 

[HenryT]

Originally posted by merlin
Sort of depends really.

If the definition of an audiophile is to accurately reproduce what is recorded on the media of their choice, then they are for want of a better expression "pissing in the wind" with their valve amps, tweaky cartidges, and flooby dust:duck:

Of course, if you are a music lover (all the best people are you know ), then it's purely a matter of personal taste, although there will always be those without taste entirely

So which one of those descriptions do you fit into then, Merl? I see no fitting category for those wearers of white gowns with their clipboards and oscilloscopes.