Tag Go Bye Bye

It seems like a lot of people simply couldn't get past the Audiolab thing which may well be another reason why Tag failed. OK, so they bought Audiolab and re-released similar (but in some cases, eg DAC20, heavily re-worked) products in new boxes at a higher price. Cynical? Bad business? It's a matter of opinion. It's a great pity that many people's view of Tag is still the immediate post Audiolab company.

In recent years Tag had pretty much nothing to do with the old Audiolab products any more. They weren't even for sale (new) any longer. What defined Tag (for me) was their AV32R AV processor, DPA32R digital pre-amp, T32 tuner (one of the best, if not the best, DAB tuners around) and their multichannel AV amps. None of these had anything at all to do with Audiolab and they were (and still are) excellent products of extremely high quality and excellent engineering. If I was upgrading my cheap Marantz AV receiver to a separate processor setup I would still strongly consider an AV32R, especially at the current knock down prices.

Michael.

 

Amusingly, given Gary's advertorial for Naim's solid build and quality control, the only time I saw a comparison between Tag & Naim's AV processors, it transpired that Naim simply bolt an OEM Motorola DSP engine to their pre, using another OEM board.

Tag, by comparison, use (and I quote) "the tried and tested SHARC 21065L processor with Siemens C161 micro and entirely proprietary code- an expensive route but one that confers full control to the manufacturer"

So in, reality, Naim strap a far east manufactured midrange chipset to their processor, do no research, offer the bare minimum of facilities, and sell it for the same price as the Tag AV30. Nice margins if you have enough die hards to fork up the cash

Maybe explains why, when they launched the AV2 at the Bristol Show in 2002, the whole room emptied when the started the system up Quite possibly the worst multichannel performance I had heard, the Rotel JBL demo, at the same show, completely destroyed it for me and many others.

So part of the reason that Tag have gone under is that they tried heroically to do new technology properly, Naim simply haven't.

 

so what you're saying merlin is that tag take an outdated slow old processor, lash up some code and then release patches for it under the guise of 'updates' to cover their shoddyness.

actualy i think there's a little more to naims av2 than you credit it with. e.g. it is updateable and the control code is also proprietory a-la tag. as for emptying rooms at a show. from what i understand no system performs it;s best in an mdf walled hotel room. even the tact gear was struggling from what i hear (anecdotally of course).

cheers

julian

 

Nice attempt at a get back merliln Hows the graphic equaliser?

I heard the AV set up at bristol, I thought it was OK considering they were using one of those section wall thingies.

But I have heard it sounding a lot better. Of course Tag was clearly the route to go down, after all lets look at how sucesfully they are doing right now, oh wait hang on....

 

Garyi, how about a non graphic EQ for a listen then?, My system uses an older chipset than the one in the CDS3
Should be a fair comparison, no 552 either it's worth a go, just to watch my transport 'boucing up and down' on the sink WM

 

Julian, no that's not what I am saying, although buying an OEM motherboard and chipset and simply dropping it in seems more Pioneer or Kenwood than the fabulously built and R&D'd Naim

The AV guys are totally hooked up on having the very latest chipset anyway. In my experience, the actual software code that is written makes the most difference, hence the old chipset but industry leading sound that is found in Lexicon processors.

I guess it's not surprising, given their experience in studio reverb, that they should still lead the way (old chipset or not ). Meridian's licensing of Trifield is another intelligent implementation of proprietry software, and another reason why they are class leaders.

Oh but it does cost money to develop this, a large amount of R&D time is required. Fair play to Tag for trying with TMREQ and TMSurround, both very worthy innovations (now there's a word rarely uttered in Salibury )

 

Krell uses the same Cirrus DSP chip as Lex 12... :MILD:

 

Ah but then I don't see, as I said before, any studio reverb heritage or DSP expertise at Krell.

Having said that, I am glad you are warming to it, it's the music that's important when all's said and done.

I know that they are knocking them out at the moment, with the generous trade in offer, so it may be a wise move for you Antonio.

Do see if you can borrow some decent and musical balanced cables though, Cardas might warm things up a tad, WM's Acoustic Zens seem fairly musical and Kimber Select KS1120 has a wonderful midrange and smooth treble. But for heavens sake, don't pay retail for them

 

From my experience with processors, TAG old and new, Krell, some auditions of Meridian 800, plus several receivers, Denon, Onkyo, SONY, HK, etc, I reckon the most important is the audio analog path, + power supplies, I can live without those fancy proprietary DSPs, as long as I have decent room equalisation, Dolby Prologic II is more than good enough for me...

I didn't use the trade-in offer, I don't need their power, my Brystons are better :MILD: , and I didn't have anything to trade, I just returned the new TAG to my dealer, the Showcase costs 4.000 US$ in the states, 6.900 euros here, still half the price of their upper level Standard 7.1 and has the same chips, box, etc...

Siltech Classic has been highly recommended to me, if you find some cheap on the net, let me know... :beer:

 

Give www.audiogon.com a try . They may not have that particular model [at the moment] but have loads of good bargains in there.

 

Thanks... :beer:

 

Tag have dropped prices

GAZZ

 

What do you guys think of the tag cd20 transport and is it worth buying at a reduced price. I have a tag dac20

GAZZ

 

i like tag transports so i would. good solid engineering.
more over i like to have my hifi from one manufacturer as they are more likely to work together. at least they look nice as a pair so that would be another reason. however, that may not be as important to you.

any chance for you to listen to one before going for it?

 

Hi

I own a Tag Transport. I've had it for over 3 years. It's a well built piece of kit. Well worth a look at. I have used it with a Tag Dac20 ( a good match) & currently use it with a Chord Dac64 (a better one). It offers very good sound quality. I have enjoyed using it.

I've not tweaked the insides but it responds to cable & mains products.

SCIDB

 

IME this also applies surprisingly well to the DAC 20, again mine has never been opened (yet ). Infact we've had the one running here to the point where WM's critisms of it were only that it was just too "neutral and safe", which has to be taken as a recommendation

Cheers

 

:lol: (Tag Nut)


Finally.

:guiness:

 

Looks like reports of Tag's demise were greatly exaggerated

From the website:

So, they're doing pretty much what most people said they should: stick to AV and bin the rest. What a monumental PR disaster this whole episode has been for them. For anyone looking for a discount on Tag stuff - it's too late, RRPs are all the rage again

Michael.

 

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=tagnut

 

Awwww! How sad! We will all miss that high-end stuff!

So I guess we will have to pick up the surplus stock at Richer Sounds for a few hundred quid!
:banana: