Top Analogue Set Up?

Heed Orbit 2

Absolutely worth demoing, just check and see if it is compatible with your Spacedeck. I found significant improvements in depth, attack, and musicality. Extremely solid build for the price. A teriffic value!

Cheers, Dex

 

Nice avatar Dexter

 

Merlin,

Have you ever listened to any of the Roksan TTs? I'm thinking along the lines of the TMS2 for the kind of money you're looking at, (not exactly sure of the price but should be in buget with arm and cart). I've never actually heard a NA TT but in my experience it is likely to sound very similar to all the other heavy platter TTs I've heard. The Roksans presentation is more open, faster and "bouncy". May be more up your street.


GTM

 

I actually have heard the TMS2 both at the shows and at a dealers. I suspect the circumstances were not ideal but it didn't shout "buy me" if you know what I mean.

I do seem to be veering towards an unsuspended deck at the moment, but I must admit to considering the aestetics as well as the sonics. After all, some of those tt's are works of art in themselves.

The more I look, the more expensive decks come out of the woodwork. Do you need a multi thuosand pound cartridge to appreciate these top models?

 

No, quite the reverse. My Well Tempered reference with a £500 Dynavector 17D2 was way better than the LP12 / Aro / Armageddon with £1800 TeKaitora it replaced. I think the Well Tempered would have walked it with just a £250 DV 10X5. Mind you the TeKaitora then sounded even better on the Well Tempered, I was hearing more of what it was capable of. Bearing in mind that cartridges wear it is more economic to invest in the turntabe imho.

Cheers

Jason

 

Many thanks for that Jason.

I was hoping I would be able to spend the bulk of the investment on the tt/arm combo. The running costs of a set of 300B's and a Koetsu would be rather hard to bear (about £1.50 per album!)

Now if we go beyond the likes of the Scoutmaster/SDS, SME20.2A, NA Dais price point, are we really just paying for aestetics when we look at the Simon Yorke S7 and the Avid Acutus? At what point does the law of diminishing returns kick in with avengence?

 

With turntables the law of diminishing returns is pushed a little more than say CD players. But it is more about finding the one that suits you for whatever reasons and matching arm and cartridge to it. Presonnally I would take my WTR over several more expensive decks that I have heard because its particular strengths work well in my system. Change some components and it might be a different story.

The Simon Yorke decks look great and have a universally good reputation. The biggest issue is either finding one second hand or taking a HUGE hit if you buy new then sell it. Thats true of all the expensive decks, not just the Yorke imho.


Cheers

Jason

 

Jason, have you had the opportunity to compare the WT with the likes of the SME20 and the high end Vpi's?

 

Merlin

Are you thinking of changing any other component in your system after you get your new t/t ??. I only ask because new speakers made such a HUGE difference to the way our record player/phono amp sounds.

You may have read the post I made the other day about my new amp/speakers. My record player is quite modest - sixteen year old Roksan Xerxes with not-exactly-up-to-date power supply, twelve year old Artimez arm with out-of-date counterweight, ten year old Audio Technica ATOC30 mc cartridge [cost about £500 at the time and was one rung down from the ART-1]. I run this through a TE Microgroove +.

The turntable now sounds great. Rather than selling it in part-exchange as I'd expected I'd do I will now definitely be keeping it. I may even investigate upgrading it - Roksan sell better power supplies, improved bearings from the TMS2, plinth and counterweight improvements too - all of which would probably be cheaper than buying a new deck.

Kevin's pearl of wisdom when we last saw him was to be careful about upgrading our turntable to a way better one because then it would outshine our CD player, and then we'd no doubt want to upgrade our CD end, and so on and so on. Good advice, I think. We're happy with the sound of the Roksan and hopefully a bit of tinkering/updating will make it even better.

If you liked what you heard when listening to the SME I'd go with it, or try one of Kevin's Kuzma's. Both look built for life.

Yours ever

Paul

 

Not in the same system.

I liked a VPi TNT a lot. But it sounded very warm (too warm) in the system I heard it in. Big and bold and powerful but warm. The SME hasn't impressed me, could be the system but it just hasn't excited me when I have heard it. It was obviously good in a HiFi way but didn't make me want to listen to more music - bizarre.

All of the above could be so much crap though since everything else was different. The VPi had a Graham arm, the SME An SME and they had different cartridges.

The other big deck that did not convince me was a ClearAudio master reference with ClearAudio bits. Again didn't connect and to my ears had an odd balance with the lower mid recessed. Again this could have been a system issue.


Cheers

Jason

 

Paul/Kevin makes a good point. I rarely put a CD on nowadays and found myself bidding on the DAX for sale on eBay!

Cheers

Jason

 

Thanks Paul,

to be honest, I feel the Scout and the CD7 are not that far apart in ultimate quality at the moment, with the Scout being preferable and of course doing the things that only vinyl can.

I doubt there is much on the market that improves substantially on the CD7 so what do I do if I want a better source?

The TT won't get used all the time, I'm simply too lazy for that. But when it is, I want it to be like a trip to the gig rather than some passive music listening. I've got the CD for that.

Thanks Jason for the thoughts.

I was surprised I was impressed by the SME, it literally had me close to tears (and not just when I asked the price!). Kevin did say that it was very susceptable to choice of cartridge, but the sledgehammer bass and realistic dynamics were most impressive.

The trouble is I can't find one cheap

 

Hi Michael,

I agree with Jason on this one. The better the turntable (setup) and arm, the better the cartridge will perform. The record player is a sensitive measuring device that can be capable of measuring very small changes. There are alot of factors which gets in the way of the stylus tip reading the piece of vinyl. A top notch turntable (setup) and arm will help to reduce these factors. The better the deck & arm the more noticable the differences between cartridges.

I too have tried cheap(er) cartridges in very good decks to very good effect.
Have a read of this. This will give you some points of the ins & outs of what is needed in record playing systems.

SCIDB

 

Thanks guys,

After much umming and arhing, I have placed an order for a Vpi Scoutmaster with SDS power supply and periphery clamp.

Not one of the super decks I know, but by all accounts a good step up from the Scout without losing the very special qualities I find in that deck.

The SME remains a possibility in the future, I was very impressed by the sheer weight that thing had, and the total lack of colouration.

What I find disappointing about this process is just how difficult it is to hear many of the turntables out there. You either have to take a punt without listening, or stick to the usual suspects.

Good news is the Scoutmaster has cost about £2K less than the other pretenders so, given that the rest of the system is singing quite adequately at the moment, will enable me to stock up on some really good vinyl

 

Cheers Dex,

I'll check it out if only for the electronic speed change (I can't be doing with this fiddling with belts thing, I knock the belt off as often as get it to change speed properly). I'll also see if there is any compatibility issues, but I wouldn't have thought so. The NAS motor plugs straight into the mains and these things are supposed to (tell me if I'm wrong) just regenerate what the mains should be pushing out but too often doesn't (stable 230v, 50Hz), also the NAS motor is very low torque, so can't be drawing much current - so I can't see what compatability issues there could be, but I will check anyway.

 

Well done Michael (Merlin),

you should hear an enjoyable improvement on your pervious deck. I do think more expensive decks are better &, in your system, you will
hear the improvement.

[/QUOTE]


This is a very big bug bear. I had this when I went for the Avid Acutus. I had planned to listen to as many of the competition. First you find that dealers don't have a big choice of different high end. Next you have to travel all around the country to hear a selection. You have to be lucky to find one in stock for dem. You may struggle to hear one in your system or in a system the same as yours. Some companies won't supply your local dealer with a sample to try. I just couldn't be bothered with the hassle after a bit. I had heard it sounding top notch at a few show & had extended listen at shows. I did have a demo but it wasn't in my system. The shop seemed reluctant to let it out for a home dem, even though I offered to pay a deposit or full whack on the credit card.

While deciding what to do, one came up & I went for it.

Trying & buying hifi can be full of hassle.

I have heard an SME 30 sounding very good but getting one 2nd hand or ex dem is possible. You just have to wait. I have seen most of the current (& past ) big hitters for sale over the past 12 months. For example, Ebay has had top of range VPIs, Avids, Nottinghams, SMEs, WTs etc. Prices are can for less than half price. So there is a very good chance one will turn up.

SCIDB

 

Nice one on your new deck Mike

Im sure it will sound great, and will make you grin a lot!

NB
Im not familiar with the model, got any pics to show?

Chris

 

Hi Chris,

no piccies unfortunately - I'm useless at uploading them anyway

Try downloading the review here .

That's the model with all the toys included

 

Thanks AK.

At least I cannot be accused of putting form before functionality