What is HiFi ?

cooky1257 said:
Well, it is over the web but are you suggesting the noise floor of these samples is -20dB?It certainly isn't on my machine.mmmmm:confused:
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By noise I don't just mean hiss, I mean anything that isn't meant to be there. The original definitely has distortion as high as -20dB 'ish as I can clearly hear distortion on both samples. The other question is how loud your PC is at your seating position. I bet you can clearly hear it, I can and mine is very quiet for a PC!

Beyond about -20dB it becomes a test of picking out one distortion from another, or a test of how well you can hear in to the noise floor.
 
PC speakers? I'm using ER4P headphones and the samples over broadband and a mac though not perfect are good enough, well at least to the levels I'm getting -this isn't a test to identify particular distortion, only to identify which of the 2 samples sounds 'more' distorted and at that level it works.Either way wether you wish to play or not the distribution on the results graphs illustrate how different we all are.
 
I'm using open back headphones. The distribution shows most people get down around -12 to -20dB. Hardly anybody gets lower than -20dB.

Both samples are distorted quite badly and below about -20dB it is a case of picking out distortion mixed with distortion.

P.S. I just got 33/39 on the second to hardest PCABX distortion test, or 0.05% chance I was guessing. This is a much better test! :) I can't do the very hardest one 'maybe impossible' as they say, as I got about 44% chance of guessing!
 
This is where the line gets blurred between listening to the hi-fi or listening to the music on the hi-fi. I used to subscribe to a upmarket monthly hi-fi magazine, then one day it dawned on me that i was never going to be able to afford any of the kit shown in the magazine, i may just as well subscribed to 'Lamborgini Monthly'. So i cancelled my subcription & now get 'Penthouse' delivered instead.
 
doomjeffs said:
This is where the line gets blurred between listening to the hi-fi or listening to the music on the hi-fi. I used to subscribe to a upmarket monthly hi-fi magazine, then one day it dawned on me that i was never going to be able to afford any of the kit shown in the magazine, i may just as well subscribed to 'Lamborgini Monthly'. So i cancelled my subcription & now get 'Penthouse' delivered instead.
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will those aspirations ever be met either..? :cool:

maybe you should try readers wifes instead... :D
 
So nobody is interested in trying a better produced ABX test? The website is a bit messy I accept, so here is all you need.

The program - http://www.pcabx.com/program/ABX173_setup.exe

And the sample files.

Reference (no distortion) - http://www.pcabx.com/technical/nonlinear/piano_nlref.wav

And the distorted ones...

V-Easy - http://www.pcabx.com/technical/nonlinear/piano_5th_30pct.wav

Easy - http://www.pcabx.com/technical/nonlinear/piano_5th_10pct.wav

Harder - http://www.pcabx.com/technical/nonlinear/piano_3rd_10pct.wav

Difficult - http://www.pcabx.com/technical/nonlinear/piano_2nd_10pct.wav

Might be impossible - http://www.pcabx.com/technical/nonlinear/piano_2nd_01pct.wav

The program is easy enough to use. Just load the reference file and a distorted file in and start the test to see if you can identify which is playing in a succession of trials.

I tired the 'might be impossible' one again today and again I got 40% chance of guessing so I ain't getting better that quickly lol! Then again 40% chance of guessing is better than 100% chance of guessing!
 
I did the 'might be impossible' and got down to a 12% chance I was guessing when in fact I was sure I was guessing after about 28 out of 40!
The Klippel tests are for a range of different 'faults" in a particular driver and their relative audibility.
The distribution points to a rump average of people who really aren't that sensitive to these distortions and so what sounds hifi to them just doesn't cut it with some audio freaks;-)ergo hifi is a subjective notion below a certain point.
 
i'd be interested to see the klippel tests split into groups, pitch, timing, harmonic distortion, pre and post echo that sort of thing. so we could see to what areas of sound reproduction we are most sensitive vs the average.
 
sq225917 said:
i'd be interested to see the klippel tests split into groups, pitch, timing, harmonic distortion, pre and post echo that sort of thing. so we could see to what areas of sound reproduction we are most sensitive vs the average.
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While I agree it would be interesting I dont think they're in that kind of business -more LS driver design consultancy/measurement and modeling specialists-impressive client list-makes sense I suppose not to have to tool up but outsource some of your R&D.
Mind you if some of the belicose 'expertise' from nearby threads is anything to go by perhaps all these speaker manufacturers should just consult certain forum members:D
 

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