Cable directionality & cables

fair point Graham,i do have worse recordings than Zep,but Floyd are much better quality imo,on my lowly Rega Planar that is (Physical Grafitti is the exception,and the forth album,but they are all different,part of the appeal i suppose)
 
Originally posted by 7_V
Can we assume that the vibration you describe in each 'phase' of Mana is inaudible?
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Yes it is inaudible (to me).

If you play a record with the speakers muted, you can hear the cartridge. I can't hear any motor or other noise from the TT when it is rotating without a record playing, but the vibrations which are generated in the turntable are very very small in amplitude. They must be detectable by some means or other. There is a slight mechanical noise from the CD transport, again only audible when standing close to it & with the speakers muted, but nothing audible from the stands.

The vibrations generated by the speakers are (of course!) audible. Since the Mana stand is coupled to the speaker cabinets (the cabinet stands upon a thick sheet of glass supported by 4 'tuned' spikes below, which are mounted on a steel frame; there is a 'lip' at the front of this frame, and spikes at the rear of the frame which 'grip' the cabinet to ensure a good physical transfer of energy from cabinet to frame) the stand, in effect, becomes a part of the speaker cabinet. This tends to 'take out' cabinet resonances, which reduces any cabinet colorations and 'overhang'.

With music playing, you cannot hear the speaker stands vibrating beneath, but you can feel them vibrating with your fingers.

The speaker cabinets themselves palpably vibrate less, the more phases you add beneath.

Also, this theory seems to work on the assumption that the vibrational energy starts at the top and is 'drained away'. Surely the bulk of this energy is produced by the speakers interacting with the floor. How does the mana work for this
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Most of the speaker/floor interactions seem to be in the bass. Most conventional (non-Mana) speaker stands tend to couple the cabinet direct to the floor, which results in a lot of vibration in the floor, which you can feel through your feet (or hands if you put them down onto the floor). Mana attenuates this effect because a lot of the vibrational energy from the speaker cabinets has been dissipated in the phases which lie in-between the cabinet and the lower-most phase, IYSWIM.

Have you tried Mana under your speakers? If not, you might well be very surprised indeed at the effect.
 
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Originally posted by The Devil
Have you tried Mana under your speakers? If not, you might well be very surprised indeed at the effect.
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Thanks for your clarification.

No, I haven't yet tried Mana under my speakers but I'm happy to give it a go.

When I was in Germany I visited Clockwork Audio in Cologne. They're the people who plug/sell the C37 lacquer that I'm also rather fond of. From what I understood, rather than try to deaden vibrations, they tuned them to certain frequencies which they then dealt with. They loved the Celestian SL600 ('aerolam' cabinets). Interesting. They were completely mad of course, but then, who isn't?
 
Originally posted by The Devil
You can train your hearing. When I was a student, I could never hear the murmur of mitral stenosis. Once I was told what to listen for, and with some more experience under my belt, I could.
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Dude, okay dokey...............does this mean you believe the murmur of mitral stenosis exists? If so, then in the same way so does the effect of cable directionality...................once you're told what to listen for, and with some experience under your belt.
 
Good for Michaelab that he no longer hears differences between cables, this way he wont have to replace his VDH that we auditioned yesterday in my system... :JPS:
 
I'm sad for Michael actually.

It's every bit as easy to imagine you cannot hear anything as it is to imagine you do. The power of suggestion, courtesy of Wolfy Datty & co, seems to have worked on those that are easily persuaded:(
 
im with Merlin on that

and its getting very boring and monotonous , everytime some one mentions cables they get jumped on by the naysayers.
If we hear a difference and enjoy it then there is no problem is there!
 
Originally posted by merlin
I'm sad for Michael actually.

It's every bit as easy to imagine you cannot hear anything as it is to imagine you do. The power of suggestion, courtesy of Wolfy Datty & co, seems to have worked on those that are easily persuaded:(
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:beer:
 
It's every bit as easy to imagine you cannot hear anything as it is to imagine you do.
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Not true, actually. All the research I've seen suggests quite the opposite, as does my experience. I've found it's very easy to convince myself I've heard a difference when I change a cable, or whatever. It actually takes an effort to prove to my own satisfaction that I'm fooling myself. Having made the effort I'm now quite good at spotting when I'm having myself on.

The power of suggestion, courtesy of Wolfy Datty & co, seems to have worked on those that are easily persuaded:(
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Unworthy of you, you stirrer.

I've just finished reading this:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos...6366/sr=2-1/ref=sr_2_11_1/202-8462619-9234208

Not about audiophilia, but has some obvious echoes with the anti-rationalist snake oil believers.

As for the complaint about naysayers, I reckon it cuts both ways. The believers are just as inclined to leap in at every opportunity. I suppose it's inevitable. As long as the believers accept that they're deluding themselves, what's the problem? :)

-- Ian
 
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Ian
it is getting painfuly tedious though, if some-one want to ask about cables then why cant the non-sceptics give them an answer and try to advise without all the dcap from the sceptics.

I do agree though, it goes both ways
 
S'funny isn't it. It seems to be the same people who spend money on cables (sometimes quite a lot of money, too) who are the first ones to say things like "this is getting boring", "who cares anyway" or "what does it matter" (which obviously it must do to them, since they are the ones spending money on this stuff).
Strange, eh. Wonder if there's a scientific explanation... Probably not, as it's all in the mind ;)
 
Originally posted by Kirk Bennett
You can train your hearing and so hear all sorts of things...............some of which actually exist.
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... and some of which don't. It's possible to "train" oneself into all sorts of fervently held beliefs, without that being sufficient evidence that they are true.

I could probably train myself to hear voices in my head ("YOU WILL BUY CABLES!!").

-- Ian
 
Chaps

If someone really thinks that they can hear the difference when a cable is connected one way or the other, then fair enough. I will just continue to think that they are as mad as a fish.

Also if buying expensive cable keeps someone happy, then fair enough, I will continue to think that they are a mug.

Now we are all happy.

Regards

Mick
 
So what's the cheapest cable that you can recommend?

So what's the cheapest cable that you can recommend?

I don't have money to burn. Given that it doesn't make any difference anyway, how cheap can I go on cables?
 
Re: So what's the cheapest cable that you can recommend?

Originally posted by 7_V
So what's the cheapest cable that you can recommend?
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Don't think it's the cheapest, but good mic cable should *coil* very nicely.
 

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