Sony SCD-1 mods

Well as I mentioned in some detail in the previous thread on this subject, as far as I'm aware you would have to send your SCD-1 to Germany - sounds radical I know but a friend who got his 9000ES "done" said, whilst it took a few weeks before it was returned to him, the results were/are remarkable. There are plenty of threads discussing vacuumstate on the highres forum on audioasylum www.audioasylum.com/forums/hirez/bbs.html there are also a few pages I also came across an interesting account of someone who had the well known Richard Kern (audiomod) mods undertaken to his SCD-1, the account describes a comparison between the Kern modd'd one a vacuumstate version and the Meitner SACD player and the vacuumstate SCD-1 was considered the best (in the opinion of the three guys running the comparison). I cant yet re-find the link or the page though unfortunately. I dont have any affiliation with vacuumstate so I would recommend you contact Allen Wright (see their website) if you want correct info.
 
greg said:
Well as I mentioned in some detail in the previous thread on this subject, as far as I'm aware you would have to send your SCD-1 to Germany - sounds radical I know but a friend who got his 9000ES "done" said, whilst it took a few weeks before it was returned to him, the results were/are remarkable. There are plenty of threads discussing vacuumstate on the highres forum on audioasylum www.audioasylum.com/forums/hirez/bbs.html there are also a few pages I also came across an interesting account of someone who had the well known Richard Kern (audiomod) mods undertaken to his SCD-1, the account describes a comparison between the Kern modd'd one a vacuumstate version and the Meitner SACD player and the vacuumstate SCD-1 was considered the best (in the opinion of the three guys running the comparison). I cant yet re-find the link or the page though unfortunately. I dont have any affiliation with vacuumstate so I would recommend you contact Allen Wright (see their website) if you want correct info.
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Thanks so much for the info, I m finding the cd proformance of the scd 1 to be slightly lacking in image compared to the likes of ML gear....not sure about wanting to send the machine to germany though, bear in mind of the cost of shipment because of the weight. If you had to chhose between the Trichord clock and never connected power supply and the Audiocom mods, which one would you go for.
Thanks in advance.
 
Class A said:
Thanks so much for the info, I m finding the cd proformance of the scd 1 to be slightly lacking in image compared to the likes of ML gear....not sure about wanting to send the machine to germany though, bear in mind of the cost of shipment because of the weight. If you had to chhose between the Trichord clock and never connected power supply and the Audiocom mods, which one would you go for.
Thanks in advance.
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I would agree the redbook replay isnt the best, though with a decent power cable and power conditioner I find it considerably better than standard output and perfectly acceptable even compared to the very best CD players I have so far heard, though it is not on that level. Regards the question: Superclock II or Trichord IV, etc. I really recommend you talk to wadia-meister, he has lots of experience and has spent lots of time trying out all sorts of components. If you dont want to send your machine to Germany I recommend you consider sending it to Cheltenham.
 
greg said:
I would agree the redbook replay isnt the best, though with a decent power cable and power conditioner I find it considerably better than standard output and perfectly acceptable even compared to the very best CD players I have so far heard, though it is not on that level. Regards the question: Superclock II or Trichord IV, etc. I really recommend you talk to wadia-meister, he has lots of experience and has spent lots of time trying out all sorts of components. If you dont want to send your machine to Germany I recommend you consider sending it to Cheltenham.
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Greg

I do own a missing link ref power cable and a isotek minisub 2 vision, so I guess the power is very clean. Ok , I will mail Wadia- meister for help. I nearly brought a pair of kef 107/2 until the misses forbiden them. ( you lucky guy)
cheers
 
Class A said:
Greg

I do own a missing link ref power cable and a isotek minisub 2 vision, so I guess the power is very clean. Ok , I will mail Wadia- meister for help. I nearly brought a pair of kef 107/2 until the misses forbiden them. ( you lucky guy)
cheers
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My missus isnt too pleased with the Kefs. She has kind of accepted them, but would be happy to see them go. I have to say, even though they are far from perfect, they are good: articulate, good imaging, good dynamics, but can show the flaws in upchain gear and poor software. I'll never sell them though (sorry Justine).
 
greg said:
My missus isnt too pleased with the Kefs. She has kind of accepted them, but would be happy to see them go. I have to say, even though they are far from perfect, they are good: articulate, good imaging, good dynamics, but can show the flaws in upchain gear and poor software. I'll never sell them though (sorry Justine).
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Greg
What amps are you using to drive the kefs???
 
Class A said:
Greg
What amps are you using to drive the kefs???
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There lies the exact problem I am still looking for a solution to. I currently have a Cyrus 7 with PSX-R, which is now surplus to requirements, I have a Lavardin IS Ref which I like very much, but could be better matched regards speakers, and I currently have connected a Krell KAV-300i which works well with the Kefs in a number of ways but is not the perfect match long term - fun though.
 
greg said:
There lies the exact problem I am still looking for a solution to. I currently have a Cyrus 7 with PSX-R, which is now surplus to requirements, I have a Lavardin IS Ref which I like very much, but could be better matched regards speakers, and I currently have connected a Krell KAV-300i which works well with the Kefs in a number of ways but is not the perfect match long term - fun though.
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I have tried many amp set up with my kefs and finally settled for the Plinus. The shear power from the plinius 450 wrms @4 ohms class A does it for me.
Tried the ML 331 100w class a had similar sound to the plinius but without the shear weight....you can never have too much power....... :D
I also tried the big krells and found them to be too bright and clinical, although the krells had the biggest bass slam heard to date, but just didnt do it for me.
Good luck with the search....
You are more than welcome to drop by and have a listen to my setup for valuation on the plinius. I can get you very good prices on plinius gear as I know the distrubutor, so no middle mans cut.
cheers
 
Class A said:
I have tried many amp set up with my kefs and finally settled for the Plinus. The shear power from the plinius 450 wrms @4 ohms class A does it for me.
Tried the ML 331 100w class a had similar sound to the plinius but without the shear weight....you can never have too much power....... :D
I also tried the big krells and found them to be too bright and clinical, although the krells had the biggest bass slam heard to date, but just didnt do it for me.
Good luck with the search....
You are more than welcome to drop by and have a listen to my setup for valuation on the plinius. I can get you very good prices on plinius gear as I know the distrubutor, so no middle mans cut.
cheers
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Interesting comments. Certainly the Krell driving the Kefs produces a powerful seemingly unconstrained sound, the bass control is good, the distortion seems to remain pretty low even at volumes that are utterly neighbour unfriendly and at these levels I never cease to be surprised by the agility and unforced control.

In many ways the results are good, but there is no doubt it is on the bright side and on more extreme recordings the sibilance of a cymbal crash when loud is searing to the ears!

In contrast, in other ways the brightness remains on the acceptable side of "forward" sounding and with the decent imaging of the Krell added to the good imaging of the Kefs this creates a vivid and relatively unveiled sound, though not anything like as natural as the Lavardin (but not actually bad at all).

Though the 105/3 differs in some ways to the 107/2, they are generally similar. The fact you front end with an SCD-1 aswell - I'd be interested to hear your setup with the Plinius pre/pwr. Where are you based?
 
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Class 'A'
I didn't realise you had the Plinus stuff, I owned the 250 power amp for a while (big grab handles, silver, big and heavy, combined with the Kef's I personaly feel that the Vacumstate mods are the way to go, my tinkerings will take you in a different direction, so a mail to Germany for some prices would be my advice
 
greg said:
Interesting comments. Certainly the Krell driving the Kefs produces a powerful seemingly unconstrained sound, the bass control is good, the distortion seems to remain pretty low even at volumes that are utterly neighbour unfriendly and at these levels I never cease to be surprised by the agility and unforced control.

In many ways the results are good, but there is no doubt it is on the bright side and on more extreme recordings the sibilance of a cymbal crash when loud is searing to the ears!

In contrast, in other ways the brightness remains on the acceptable side of "forward" sounding and with the decent imaging of the Krell added to the good imaging of the Kefs this creates a vivid and relatively unveiled sound, though not anything like as natural as the Lavardin (but not actually bad at all).

Though the 105/3 differs in some ways to the 107/2, they are generally similar. The fact you front end with an SCD-1 aswell - I'd be interested to hear your setup with the Plinius pre/pwr. Where are you based?
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Greg
I live in sidcup, kent..
If you are intrested in an audition, e mail me [email protected] and I will reply with contact details.
cheers
 
wadia-miester said:
Class 'A'
I didn't realise you had the Plinus stuff, I owned the 250 power amp for a while (big grab handles, silver, big and heavy, combined with the Kef's I personaly feel that the Vacumstate mods are the way to go, my tinkerings will take you in a different direction, so a mail to Germany for some prices would be my advice
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Thanks for that Wadia-miester, if I do decide to go Vac. and buy the parts, can you fit them for me?. for a price ofcourse...
Cheers
 
joel said:
I'm not too interested in this kind of thing for the most part, but for another view of your Sony and why it sounds the way it does, look here:
http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hirez/messages/15679.html
Jonathan is one of the very few who *really* knows their stuff and doesn't huff & bluff.
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Interesting pointer Joel, thanks. One of the comments I would make regards the SCD-1 and CD playback is perhaps the Sony engineers wanted to ensure the SACD performance was clearly "better" (relative interpretation, etc.) than the redbook performance in order to promote SACD.

As I understand things the core objective of creating the SCD-1 was to tour shows using it as a vehicle to demonstrate the SACD format. As such the RRP was apparently very lacking in any profits for Sony in order to act as a loss leader (along with the 777ES). This was one of the reasons that pursuaded me to buy one. One good aspect of the vacuumstate concept is you retain the original output stage/sockets along with the new stage/sockets so you get to compare the Sony preferred sound to the vacuumstate preferred sound.

I do feel the asking price for the SCD-1 even new price was great value (c. £3000). Used prices <£1500 is an absolute steal IMO and the 777ES goes for sub £1000. Not everyone likes the sound I guess, but I certainly recommend people get a listen to one before forming an opinion.
 
greg said:
Interesting pointer Joel, thanks. One of the comments I would make regards the SCD-1 and CD playback is perhaps the Sony engineers wanted to ensure the SACD performance was clearly "better" (relative interpretation, etc.) than the redbook performance in order to promote SACD.

As I understand things the core objective of creating the SCD-1 was to tour shows using it as a vehicle to demonstrate the SACD format. As such the RRP was apparently very lacking in any profits for Sony in order to act as a loss leader (along with the 777ES). This was one of the reasons that pursuaded me to buy one. One good aspect of the vacuumstate concept is you retain the original output stage/sockets along with the new stage/sockets so you get to compare the Sony preferred sound to the vacuumstate preferred sound.

I do feel the asking price for the SCD-1 even new price was great value (c. £3000). Used prices <£1500 is an absolute steal IMO and the 777ES goes for sub £1000. Not everyone likes the sound I guess, but I certainly recommend people get a listen to one before forming an opinion.
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Greg

I have since contacted Collin @ cpt and discussed all the matters regarding the pros and cons about mods that are conducted by himself and that of others. The guy seems to know his stuff. I think I will for now go for the thrichord clock 4 and the never connected power supply which is only avaliable through Thrichord and see the improvements befor I go further.
 
Class A said:
Greg

I have since contacted Collin @ cpt and discussed all the matters regarding the pros and cons about mods that are conducted by himself and that of others. The guy seems to know his stuff. I think I will for now go for the thrichord clock 4 and the never connected power supply which is only avaliable through Thrichord and see the improvements befor I go further.
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Certainly most people who have expressed an opinion to me prefer the Trichord clock to the Superclock II and the NCS is again consistently rec'd. Keep me posted on the results. Cheers.
Greg
 
I think the SCD-1 was above developed as an audiophile TOTL model for Japan. But as Sony is a more global company than most...
You will be very sad to hear that the price new in Japan was closer to 2,000 quid than it was to 3,000.
Do consider Jonathan's words carefully.
 
Just for the record, it was available in the UK for just under £2000 for a short period at end of 2000, then Sony jacked the prices up. I got mine brand new from unbeatable.com for £1949.95. That's less than you see them advertised second hand nowadays.

Today you can get the current generation Sony players from the same sources (techtronics.com is another good one) for substantially less than retail - £700 saving on the SCD-XA9000ES. At those prices, the proper hifi shops will never bother stocking or demo-ing these players so they will go unrecognized and unheralded amongst the public. Thus slowing down the take up of SACD as an audiophile format.
 
joel said:
I think the SCD-1 was above developed as an audiophile TOTL model for Japan. But as Sony is a more global company than most...
You will be very sad to hear that the price new in Japan was closer to 2,000 quid than it was to 3,000.
Do consider Jonathan's words carefully.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure the SCD-1 was developed simply to sell to the Japanese market - I'm sure Sony's more significant objective would be the global launch of the SACD format. I do appreciate Jonathan's comments but firstly he acknowledges he is not talking from experience regards the SCD-1, but applying what he has learnt about the likely approach applies to its development, which I think in part is true about the SCD-1.

However, a broad range of people with good experience, have found there are certain components in the SCD-1 which are notably "cheap" - the clock is one of them. Its likely Sony would not IMO, for example, consider installing a Trichord or Superclock. On the other hand - yes perhaps there are a number of more typical components selected quite deliberately regardless of not being percieved as audiophile grade.

Dont get me wrong - I like the sound of the SCD-1 in redbook. Its tight, fast, lively, rhythmical and detailed, but it can sound a little hard and lacks a little in natural timbre at times. The nice thing about the vacuumstate package is you get to keep the Sony output/sound too.
 
alanbeeb said:
Just for the record, it was available in the UK for just under £2000 for a short period at end of 2000, then Sony jacked the prices up. I got mine brand new from unbeatable.com for £1949.95. That's less than you see them advertised second hand nowadays.

Today you can get the current generation Sony players from the same sources (techtronics.com is another good one) for substantially less than retail - £700 saving on the SCD-XA9000ES. At those prices, the proper hifi shops will never bother stocking or demo-ing these players so they will go unrecognized and unheralded amongst the public. Thus slowing down the take up of SACD as an audiophile format.
Click to expand...

There's no doubt that the better Sony machines dont register on the radar for most audiophools. Thats not to suggest (or not suggest) they are the best machines available, but many folks would never want their sys fronted by a Sony, regardless of the quality of playback.
 

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