speaker cable

That's another one. Have you considered why it is necessary for you to report so many posts?

SM if you don't like it here feel free to leave. There are other fora for you to join. I'm not however going to allow you and one or two others to constantly pollute this forum with your constant arguing.

 

I'm not arguing - I'm making a point. If a few people fancy having a pop because they don't like being questioned, that's not really my problem.

I love it here I'm afraid, and I'm not going anywhere. I will continue to respect the AUP as laid out in the sticky. Of course if you make it a policy to not allow questioning of belief structures then I and a few others may fall foul of your new rules ;-)

Interestingly I don't have problems anywhere else - debates are civil and no one is allowed to say things that would get them a smack in the face were they to say them to someone's face. Maybe a "life lesson" there eh ;-)

 

A very hard life lesson for everyone is how not to have to have the last word even when one is right.

 

In serious danger of actually answering the question and not picking an argument with anyone, Neotech cables are re-badged by a number of manufacturers.

The £600+ pure silver Ecosse Legend is a Neotech cable. It used to be available in 1m pairs from HiFiCables for £250, in the white/green braid shown on the Ecosse site.

From looks alone, it looks as though Acoustic Zen use Neotech cables, but as I'm not 100% sure, I won't say definitively.

The advantage of Neotech is that their cable tends to be cheaper than another company that simply re-badges, re-covers or re-terminates it.

Whether their cables are of benefit to you is a different matter.

Personally, I owned three pairs of their silver interconnects for a while and thought they were excellent.

 

The majority of Wigwam is in the cables make a difference camp.

The majority of Pinkfish is in the cables don't make a difference camp.

Zerogain has no majority, it's a total battlefront. Which is a shame but it had to happen somewhere.

And it'll never stop until the people who can hear a difference between cables prove to the LCR lot that they can. Until then the LCR camp will continue to rip the piss.

 

...or until some people let others make there own choices.

eg IMO no one needs to "police" the forum, with sweeping theories backed up by apparantly overwhelming scientific evidence.

 

similarly traders out to make a buck shouldn't be allowed to pose as fellow amateurs.

 

I don't know anyone out to make a "quick buck", as you put it, Bob.

 

My sentiments exactly - and they surely can't expect to post pseudo science posing as the real thing without being held to account? If they want to advertise like that - then take a quarter page in one of the magazines - please don't infiltrate forums.

 

Battlefront? I don't like to think so. I believe there is a majority here who hear a difference.
Why don't we take a survey? Lets really see what the majority is.
Personally IMO its not the cable its the price thats the root of the cable debates. If they were all inexpensive there would be no arguement.
Everything about the IC can make a difference. The conductors specs, the connectors, the winding, solder,dielectric. The LCR matters as that is what you need to know to synergize the cable with your system. Its a good thing to know and would probably narrow the chase. IMO we need more published specs from manfs to make the choice easier. However in the end, if it dosn't sound right the chase continues for me at least.


rollo

 

Hi Rollo

A poll was done not so long ago.

When people who believed that ''money spent on cables was better spent elsewhere'' were added to '' cables make no difference'' the quantity was roughly equal to those that believed in speaker cables/interconnects.

It wasn't a very good poll however (In my opinion) because there were too many options, and some conflicted.

 

yeh i voted for money spent on cables is better spent elsewhere.

but all that says is that i believe they don't provide the greatest increase in audio quality for the money compared to anything else, not that cables don't make a diffference.

you cant ask one question and infer another.

i don't for one minute beleive that if you asked, "can cables make a difference" question on PFM the majority would vote no.

 

we could run the polls here on PFM.. a much simpler one.. you know...
a) cables sound different because of LCR differences
b) cables sound different to each other because of other reasons that are yet unknown

or something.

doesnt sound like a very good saturday night however.

a few beers does.... speaking of which

 

remember that according to the sceptics if we hear a difference we are "imagining" it....so that don't count....

exactly

john smiths origional ....as I write.

 

David f
I didn't say 'quick buck'.
Don't you sell your cones anymore then?

 

Why don't we just keep it simple? The question should be " Do you hear a difference in cables' ? Yes or No?

 

Sometimes I do wish you would read other people's posts before hitting the keyboard

FWIW, my position has always been any potentially audible differences between cables are clearly identifiable using established scientific metrics and are imaginary between electrically similar cables.

Let's say for argument's sake Zandenob inc. make a cable for £200 a meter. What I am saying is that if I measure the LCR characteristics of that cable, I can make a sonically identical cable using basic materials for a fraction of the price and so can another cable manufacturer. Indeed they probably do if Zandenob inc is simply trying to design a cable that passes the signal unmolested.

Importantly, silver will sound no different to copper when used in the same gauge and length. Additionally any audible differences due to LCR variations are small and will vary from one application to another. They will also prove elusive when tested under controlled conditions.

The fact that people "design" cables using nothing but their imagination, and then try to apply faulty logic and pseudo science when questioned as to the characteristics of their leads does not help the credibility of those involved in selling the product. There are people out there selling cables who don't even have the basic measuring equipment in their kitchens/laboratories to ensure that their products meet even basically acceptable levels of objective performance.

If you want to take a poll I am confident you will find a large number of ZG'ers share that view as has been evidenced in the past. The obvious solution to all this animosity is for the two camps to meet , for the products to be the subject of controlled listening tests, and for a concensus to be formed that either proves or disproves some of the more contentious claims. I still can't understand why seemingly confident individuals seem less than enthusiastic faced with such a prospect.

 

'cos you could make cable a) out of the piece of string that I use to tie the legs together of a chicken to go in the oven, and cable b) out of copper

and then I'd answer 'YES'! and everybody else would too..

 

I wonder if the chicken would taste better if you used silver ties? Hehehe. My guess would be 75% of those polled would answer yes that there is a difference. No need to mention type of cable as that would confuse matters.


rollo

 

Hey S & M

These Zandenob inc cables. That wouldn't be a play on Zanesh and knob, by any chance?