All aboard the atheist bus?

[Seeker_UK]

I've settled on genuinely.

Is gravity a fact or a theory?

Oooh! Ooh! Hang on! I think I got this one!

Gravity is a fact because we can observe its effects and they can be proven empirically.

What cannot (presently) be established as fact is the mechanism behind it.




.....can I go and lie down now?

 

[Paul Ranson]

Evolution is more of a mathematical statement...

Something like,

Given variation, heritability and a constraint on resources variations that favour survival will prevail.

It would appear that evolution is as factual as the concept of '1'. Rather more definite than the theory of theories.

Paul

 

[Haselsh1]

"Einsteins General Relativity is the Theory of Gravity"

Incorrect...!!! It is, accurately, The General and Special Theory of Relativity. Gravity is a fact and as such it is a measurable fact. Simply by virtue of measuring a bodies weight you are measuring gravity at 9.8m/s/s however I think this is drifting away from the core of this thread.

It still leaves the obvious that there is no evidence for any sort of God. Until God becomes a tangible provable thing, I shall not believe in what equates to a figment of my imagination. I have no need to believe in any such thing.

 

[anon_bb]

I would rather say that evolution is a paradigm according to the Kuhnian viewpoint. But technically speaking evoluation is a theory and theories are somewhat abstract - in the case the theory of the creation of new species and the origin of complexity

Special relativity is a subset of general relativity - I did a theoretical physics phd and did both Measurements of gravity are facts - the explanation of gravity is a theory

 

[The Devil]

A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing!

It certainly can.

"Evolution" means that a given population of organisms changes its characteristics between generations. There are innumerable observations of this process (evolution) taking place in nature: the emergence of various antibiotic-resistent bacteria being an easy, well-known example. These observations are not in dispute, and are what is known as "facts".

Scientific theories describe the coherent framework into which observable data (facts) fit. "The Theory of Evolution", means a well-supported body of interconnected statements that explains the observation of evolution and can be used to make testable predictions about it.

Gravity is a fact, and there have been scientific theories which attempt to explain it.

Evolution is a fact, and there have been scientific theories which attempt to explain it.

 

[anon_bb]

Evolution is a theory describing the emergence of new species. The thing observed is the emergence of new species. Explanatory observations include mutation, variation and natural selection. These are the facts. The theory explaining those facts is called evolution. Evolution is a theory that incorporates facts - not a fact itself. There used to be other competing theories such as Lamarkian Progress which also tried to incorporate the facts but failed under scrutiny.

There is an observed phenomena called gravity which is explained by the Theory of General Relativity. You are not comparing like with like.

The emergence of new adaptive species over time is a fact and the only current sucessful scientific theory to explain it is Darwinian Evolution (not in its original form I might add).

Dunderhead.

 

[The Devil]

Evolution is a theory describing the emergence of new species. The thing observed is the emergence of new species.

No.

"Evolution" is the process leading to emergence of new species. "The Theory of Evolution" is the theory which attempts to explain evolution.

Have you had a head injury?

 

[Haselsh1]

"Special relativity is a subset of general relativity - I did a theoretical physics phd and did both "

I studied for many years and then worked for twenty seven years in the field of physical chemistry. You're not on your own

 

[anon_bb]

I dont think chemistry includes the study of general relativity. I assure you that special relativity is just a subset of general relativity.

Bub - The theory of evolution is the theory that proposes evolution as the explanation for the observed fact of the emergence of new species. I am afraid your medical specialisation only appears to make you especially well qualified to identify yourself in the mirror - not expound upon matters of scientific philosophy and method.

 

[Haselsh1]

You don't need to assure me of anything. I studied for six years and am therefore as well versed in the art of science as anyone else that has studied it. I'm also sure that you are aware that just because one picks a main subject, in my case chemistry, one does not study other aspects of science. I spent five years studying astronomy as well. Quite a few of us have pieces of paper with decorations on them not just you.

 

[Haselsh1]

Physical chemistry has nothing whatsoever to do with any field of medicine. I thought you of all people would know that. Obviously you don't.

 

[The Devil]

The theory of evolution is the theory that proposes evolution as the explanation for the observed fact of the emergence of new species.

I'll leave you to this one. There are only so many ways I can try to educate you. You know best (as always). You are also wrong (as always).

 

[hifinutt]

whats evolution got to do with atheism? surely God created the evolutionary process .
this is an extremely interesting thread. Where i live there are very very few athiests . God is accepted as fact by my muslim/hindu/afro caribbean neighbours.

 

[anon_bb]

I am sure - however that doesnt change the fact that Einsteins General Relativity is the Theory of Gravity which is what we were debating.

You don't need to assure me of anything. I studied for six years and am therefore as well versed in the art of science as anyone else that has studied it. I'm also sure that you are aware that just because one picks a main subject, in my case chemistry, one does not study other aspects of science. I spent five years studying astronomy as well. Quite a few of us have pieces of paper with decorations on them not just you.

 

[anon_bb]

Physical chemistry has nothing whatsoever to do with any field of medicine. I thought you of all people would know that. Obviously you don't.

The 2nd part of that post was aimed at Bub not you - sorry for not pointing that out and for any offence caused I have amended the post to make it clear

 

[The Devil]

whats evolution got to do with atheism?

Nothing at all unless you are a fruit-loop fundie christian.

Where i live there are very very few athiests . God is accepted as fact by my muslim/hindu/afro caribbean neighbours.

You have my sympathy.

 

[anon_bb]

I'll leave you to this one. There are only so many ways I can try to educate you. You know best (as always). You are also wrong (as always).

Bub you are wrong - I have heard these words before from you and every time it is followed by some about face as soon as you adopt a new hifi religion. You haven't really understood what its all about and the fact that there is no real difference between the way your mind works and the way a Christians mind works and you certainly have no advantage in iq due to being an atheist

 

[The Devil]

In actual fact, you are wrong. You don't understand what the word "evolution" means. This puts you at an even bigger disadvantage than usual when you try to discuss the Theory of Evolution! Go & find out some facts.

I don't have any religion, hifi or other.

 

[D Louth 77]

Faith

I don't have any religion, hifi or other. the devil

IN MY OPINION ....

Your Belief in nothing is a form of FAITH. Therefore Atheism is a Form of FAITH and could be viewed as a RELIGION. The Humanist Society, could even be labeled as the CHURCHorganization of that FAITH. This includes even giving alternative forms of worship/ceremony, for Humanists who are ATHEISTS So therefore IMO this is a FAITH. So James you have a Religion and its called ATHEISM.

As I once said before you have more FAITH than do I, to believe that everything just came out of nothing. The visible start (BIG BANG) just happened and everything that followed was a set of random circumstances. Lot of coincidence there...

Just thought I would share that thought. This does not mean I am in this debate by the way, just making an observation.

Regards D Louth 77

 

[The Devil]

Atheism is a lack of belief in god (or gods). I think the current scientific theories about the beginning of the universe are far more likely to be correct, or at least partially correct, than are those found in an ancient manuscript.

My stance on religion is that, in general, it causes a lot of harm, and very little good. It also prevents certain people from thinking.