[Review] Getting animated

zanash said:
Tones I'm not going to bandy words with you
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Good, let's bandy legs instead! (Assuming, of course, you've got one to stand on).

.....the fact is you've chosen to tell people this unit does not do what is claimed

a/ on the tin ...as they say
b/ my listening result
c/ other peoples listening results

then you've the gall to claim you have not

so don't come the innocent.....
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Pure as driven slush.

All the readers can quickly sort that one out just by reading through your posts.
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What's to sort out? It doesn't work. You believe it does. You think you're right. I know I'm right. End of story.:D
As you say you can't hear these things ...which then begs the question why are you posting to this thread in the first place ?
...your looking suspiciously troll like
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You mean, you don't like the expression of contrary opinions?
But you do have a the right to post your opinion, which is noted ...
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Aha, clearly not.
But you don't have the right to thrust your views down peoples throats as "gospel" when it plainly flys in the face of all the hands on experience ...
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But, on the other hand... Who's thrusting? You are staunchly maintaining your point of view. Do you hear me saying, "Pete, you're thrusting your views down my throat"?

May be if you were to accept for a moment[suspend your disbelief] that this might just do whats claimed, you could then perhaps postulate how the thing does what it does.....rather than reverting to dogma.
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It works by removing rather a large amount of money from people's pockets, thus pushing them into the Emperor's New Clothes syndrome. :D
Train time. Goodnight all,. Don't miss me too much.
 
Pete, you keep playing the offended card, there's no need.

My ears tell me that cables, mains, stands, shakti stones, and all the other numerous tweaks I have tried make no difference at all, or such a small difference that it probably only exists in my head, so I am in complete agreement with Tony. I'm also in complete agreement with Pete and others when they say "Use your ears", since it's by doing exactly that that I have reached my conclusions. There's no need for anyone else to get upset by this, unless they're selling snake oil, in which case they should expect to be given a hard time for taking money fraudulently. But anyone who routinely posts uncritical paeans to tweakery (especially expensive tweakery) should expect to get a sceptical response, and get used to it.

-- Ian
 
Why Am I not surprised ?

Offended ..me ...naw ....why should I be offended when someone says I'm not hearing something when I am and clearly not on my own ....

by the way, have you ignored the other posters who have testified to the efficacy of the unit ?

Tones ..dosen't wash ...you came onto my thread telling me what I can and can't hear and think.

If you want to start a review thread on the animator ...go ahead. Actually thats not a bad idea .........though you'd need to get hands on experience otherwise, you'd have no credibility. You can then tell people how you know it doesn't work. You can organize visits to other forum members across your particular country [at your own expense] and then when you get back demo the unit to friends and acquaintances....garner all there opinions and maybe hope one or two might post of there own volition. But that would be too much like hard work ...when you can come and troll this thread.
 
sideshowbob said:
Pete, you keep playing the offended card, there's no need.
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No, theres not.

sideshowbob said:
There's no need for anyone else to get upset by this,
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agreed

sideshowbob said:
unless they're selling snake oil, in which case they should expect to be given a hard time for taking money fraudulently. But anyone who routinely posts uncritical paeans to tweakery (especially expensive tweakery) should expect to get a sceptical response, and get used to it.
-- Ian
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agreed again



I have to say I find Tones notes a little contradictory but I think theres soem thing I'm missing in his arguements.

A Tones says himself, hes not as audiophile, content to listen to music on a system he finds more than adequate; hes not alone, my brother isn't interested in tweaking his MF/spendor combo. I, on the other hand get anormous amount of fun from taking basic materials and seeing what tonal differnces I get form minimising vibrations or getting pete to put cables together (that platalloy DID sound good, what ever the doubters say pete!!........(:D ))

AS I say I can't entirley get my head around Tones logic....but hey.........;)
 
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zanash said:
Tones ..dosen't wash ...you came onto my thread telling me what I can and can't hear and think.
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No he didn't, that's simply untrue, Tony has simply stated what he believes and at no time has told you what to think. You can say what you like and believe what you like, but so can Tony, or me, or anybody else, whether or not they agree with you. The same goes for me, it doesn't bother me in the slightest if a True Believer tells me that they think I'm deaf just because I don't believe in their latest tweakery, they're entitled to their opinion and I'm entitled to think they're wrong, and vice-versa.

My view is that sarcasm and ridicule is an appropriate reaction to audiophile tweakiness, because I think it's a silly neurosis and a waste of time that would be better spent listening to music or reading books or getting drunk or having a shag. But it's nothing personal, you're welcome to do and think whatever you like, that goes without saying.

-- Ian
 
What would be the point of having a discussion forum if there were no discussions, but just an agreement to disagree?

-- Ian
 
Well said ....

ah but then they can't come on my thread and troll...

last time I looked this was the review section ...... As previously stated if you want to setup a contrary thread be my guest ....
 
tones said:
What's to sort out? It doesn't work. You believe it does. You think you're right. I know I'm right. End of story.:D

.
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This is where I come unstuck Tones,..

"It doesn't work".....you've stated "it" doesn't work!

(blue light/cable/whatever)

.....that to me doesn't sound like a personal opinion but a statement of fact....that encompasses everybody

I wonder......

if you took 100 people off the street at random and asked htem to do a blind a/b test where a= a cr**py piece of bell wire and b= good quality inter /connect .....shall we say made out of silver/gold (who evers)........brought them down to my place....and asked them to assess for various parameters......if 75% (of course assuming 75% DID!) said they thought the silver/gold sounded better, would you then say they were imagening the improvement/ wanted to here it?

After all they (ie the 100 random listeners) have little interest either way?!

A rhetorical/ficticious experiement....of course



.....
 
sideshowbob said:
My view is that sarcasm and ridicule is an appropriate reaction to .....
-- Ian
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Really??

If you don 't agree with some thing aren't you best just turning the other cheek...........horses for courses........!??
 
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DavidF said:
Really??

If you don 't agree with some thing aren't you best just turning the other cheek...........horses for courses........!??

(I was ridiculed as a kid......its not nice!!)
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I don't ridicule individuals, I ridicule tweakery. Different thing. It's all part of having a sense of humour.

-- Ian
 
DavidF said:
if you took 100 people off the street at random and asked htem to do a blind a/b test where a= a cr**py piece of bell wire and b= good quality inter /connect .....shall we say made out of silver/gold (who evers)........brought them down to my place....and asked them to assess for various parameters......if 75% (of course assuming 75% DID!) said they thought the silver/gold sounded better, would you then say they were imagening the improvement/ wanted to here it?

After all they (ie the 100 random listeners) have little interest either way?!

A rhetorical/ficticious experiement....of course



.....
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No one would say that, as a properly conducted blind A/B test with that outcome would prove that there was an audible difference. But such tests have been done and show there to be no audible difference.

....so really it is anyone who thinks there is an audible difference between electrically similar cables who is saying the hundreds of listeners were incorrect/hearing what they wanted.
 
Tenson said:
No one would say that, as a properly conducted blind A/B test with that outcome would prove that there was an audible difference.
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....good


Tenson said:
But such tests have been done and show there to be no audible difference.
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.......probably taking casual listeners. you do need to now what you a5re looking for....ie extra resolution , soundstage.....the average man in the street may not pick that at up at once.



Tenson said:
....so really it is anyone who thinks there is an audible difference between electrically similar cables who is saying the hundreds of listeners were incorrect/hearing what they wanted.
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....or as above .......??


thinking about this, my brother with his MF/spendor combo i'sn't in the least intereted in tweaking ...but I think he would just say....he likes stuff as it is and can't be ar*ed to play around with other stuff (cables etc)...

not sure as he would say other stuff can't work though....
 
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Phew its been a busy day on here today. Dont you lot go to work? Ill need all night to read this lot.

Pete's coming round this Saturday (hopefully) with the device thats causing all this debate. I may hear it or i may not. I think my theory is proving correct and peoples brains perceive things slightly different.

I do know that pete can pick things up better than me as he hears the change for the better when he demo's, but sometimes i don't. When i am in my usual listening environment on my own, thats when i hear it. For instance i couldnt hear is interconnect cables when he demo'd but when he sent me a pair and i sat down to listen i was gobsmacked.
 
Jimbo said:
Phew its been a busy day on here today. Dont you lot go to work? Ill need all night to read this lot.
.
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yes, indeed i do normally.

I signed off this last shift as was obviously fighting something off...Ive been knocked out for a best part of 2 weeks...haven't done anything. Intensely annoying.

I saw the Doc about ropey knees yesterday........said he had had the same thing..........he walked around the garden and that was it.
 

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