ATC studio monitors

Paul, at least 30 systems or the last 3 years or so quite easily out gunned the atc's in extention, cohesiveness and timing. most have been cheaper too. The atc's will fill the room without question (loudness), won't argue that. However, The just don't do deep and articulately timed bass or for that matter much involving muisc. I used to own 50's for 5 months so I've had a fair crack at them.
I have at least 8 clients with ATC actives ranging from 20's to 150's and one system has 5 yes 5 150's and the the genetlemen felt need to add 2 matching subs to fill in the missing registars. (This gent is not a customer)
I found that modifing the passive versions and adding quality amplification (the OE units are certainly nothing special) this raises their preformance to a much more enjoyable standard & listenable standard, this is my personal view.
Have you checked their are in phase Paul?, seems to be the odd factory issue on this score?
I won't quote any customer feed back as you requested.
I find them nothing special at all mind you I feel the yammys are worse !!! so there are not that bad.
In same way I suspect you'll 'like' the meadowlarks in the way, its horses for coarses and you'll find some poeple just prefer something different.
However they certainly arn't top draw in my book. However it doesn't make them any less appealing to other people.
 
The Devil said:
He's pushing his own products, I had a little look at his website: bashing the opposition does no harm to his sales, I guess.

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Same old Ju-Ju stick your using again James :rolleyes: maybe try another Tact like Thorsen doesn't rate them, accept it its not harming you. Unless? you have a unstable ego with a dash of inferiority complex.
But then, that can't be you James, that fine upstanding pillar of the medical community north of the boarder :)
 
I'd still appreciate an answer to the two questions, from both of you.

What exact system 'failed' with your 50's? Which is your benchmark system now?
 
By an odd coincidence Meadowlark and Omiga Audio have both gone "tits-up" recently.

It seems you have a taste for the obsolete, Tony. Or perhaps the "Midas Touch" in reverse.

Got any racing tips? :D
 
3DSonics said:
I finally found a piece on ATC's site where they describe the X-Over topology for their active speakers. No Driveroffset correction. Whcih was also visible on the plots.
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And you believe that this is audible? Just laughable, chum.

Ciao!
 
Paul,

Failed not an accurate assumption to be fair, they just didn't give me what I'm looking for in a musicaly coherent system, namely

1. lack of involvement factor and the ability to draw you into the music, leaving a sense of lacking and low listening attention span.
2. The ability to produce deep, articulate and cohesive bass that completes the total reproductive picture.
Not to be confused with 114db loundness.
Equipment used with the Atc's Wadia 8/15 combo (moded) Wadia 25 dac Dcs Delius and percell, meridain 500 transport, Accuphase dp65, opus 21 (Yuk) Copland 289
Meridain 588, preramps,the atc cheaper one, spectral dc15/dc30, Hovland, Manley, AR, Conrad Johnson, Pass labs X2.5. Belcanto Pre 1.
Benchmark, for total OTT a Spectral/Mad Wadia/Egglestone works systems, truley nuts beyond reason really mad money.
Real world, Wadia SE Hybrid/Belcanto/Meadowlarks, can swop the B/c's for Edge or Spectral 360 mono's and the speakers for Vandisteins 5 a's, Apogee's, Blue Heron 2's (modded of coarse!!). the list is pretty extensive.
Though its all done to how you wish your music to be, mine is different to yours.
If we all like the same hey they'd sell out of Hook norton pint pots and bearded fisherman sweeters in short order I feel !!!
 
James, Your assuming too much again, steady on, remeber the last time you used both of the grey cells at the same time, took you weeks to recover .No I merely like the company so much I bought it :)
 
wadia-miester said:
1. lack of involvement factor and the ability to draw you into the music, leaving a sense of lacking and low listening attention span.
2. The ability to produce deep, articulate and cohesive bass that completes the total reproductive picture.
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Well those opinions are at total variance with the stated opinions of every other visitor to my place except you, Tony. I think you are out on a limb.

Even good old analoguekid, who claimed not to like them, said that they had too much bass.

Ho hum.
 
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That's an impressive list of options to try out for sure.

I heard a great system last weekend; atc 50's, diy valve pre, tag transport, benchmark dac1. Soon to demo some other valve variations, along the lines of AR 25, EAR, BAT etc. For the money, space and box count I've yet to hear better. I really cant see how the atc bass control could come under question, especially with solid state pre's (ca2 for example).

As for extension, they won't do overwhelming sub bass, as it's not a sub bass driver. It's a bass driver. I will also use a dedicated sub, for the sub tones.

I have an open mind with regards to whats best, as I'm currently looking to spend a wedge on a new system. Going up to kj west one and cornflake to hear their best efforts soon.

Still interested what other atc haters used as their exact 'failure' system...
 
The Devil said:
By an odd coincidence Meadowlark and Omiga Audio have both gone "tits-up" recently.
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Clutching at straws James?
That is below the belt, childish and not that well educated is it.

Why is it that everytime someone says they dont like ATC you pop out from under your rock and turn troll?
People are entitled to an opinion, which, incidentaly is all you have. You harp on about other people not having facts or figures to back up their arguments, where are your facts and figures to back up your 'opinion' that ATC are the best speakers in the world?
Until you can produce the evidence, you are just an internet nerd with an axe to grind.
You do yourself no favours with these poxy and childish arguments.
 
Paul,

Worth a try is the Grounded grid pre-amp, a seriously good unit for the money available in kit form for $650 I believe very good for the dosh. Compares with many pre's at the £2k, and easily see's off a naim 282.
I feel a spot of valves with the Atc would help no end, just finding one that suits you. Wm
 
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Hi,

The Devil said:
And you believe that this is audible? Just laughable, chum.
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You mean the difference between a Speaker that has a near perfect stepresponse for a bandwidth limited bandpass and near perfect implulse response to one that rings like a bell at low frequencies and chops every step or impulse into two/three versions of itself?

As it so happens, EVEN YOU could hear that.

Ciao T
 
To get back to the subject matter, ATC make a very fine midrange dome.

The fact that they are able to stick it in a basic cabinet with a rather prosaic tweeter and bass unit along with "adequate" amplification, and get away with it, speaks volumes for the quality of this one drive unit.

ATC's featuring this drive unit are tremendously uncoloured. They do bass but truncate it before the onset of distortion which people mistake for bass. The Seas tweeter lacks resolution and I am not a great fan of the end result. But that is a personal preference. They are, taken overall, vastly superior in reproducing the recording than the majority of so called hifi speakers.
 
Merlin, sorry but I feel you are stating an opinion too, you say they have the best midrange driver and can get away with mediocre box and ordinary amps, rubbish, they get away with nothing, I happened to listen to the 50 anniversaries last week, £12K who are they kidding, looked nice in the pics and looked good from a disrtance, but up close the build quality was shocking, and as for sound quality, very shouty, very dull, No soundsatge, no dynamics, and no micro dynamics, boring sums them up, the Hyperion 938, with ayre ax7 cd (CDP was used with the atc's too) and matching amp, absolutely killed them. at 2/3rds the price (inc amp), and I believe the ayre wasn't the best match for the hyperions.
 
analoguekid said:
Merlin, sorry but I feel you are stating an opinion too,
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But that is a personal preference
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AK, I guess you failed to read my post correctly.

As for the rest, I am beginning to think that the majority of people on these forums wouldn't be able to tell colouration (or the lack of it) from their elbows. Bub baiting is both boring and so last year!
 
A balanced perspective

We have not heard a response from 3D, detailing the exact system in which the atc's 'failed'. Maybe it was due to another component in the chain, speaker placement, or the room acoustics. Maybe we'll never know.

Since reading spec sheets and magazine reviews seems popular, I can summarise one from HiFi Choice, special black edition, end of 2004. This awards edition contains all the ultimate high end hifi products to date: chord, sonus faber, krell, burmester, conrad johnson, jbl, naim, audio research, wilson, dcs, b&w, beauhorn, triangle, border patrol, tannoy, sme, audio note (ongaku!), wadia, focal jm lab,wilson benesch, martin logan, living voice, halcro, the list goes on. Every accepted ultimate component is there. So this is the summary for ATC:

"This is the most revealing and entertaining pair of speakers that this writer has had the pleasure of using in nearly two decades of reviewing." The praise is endless. If you were in doubt over their bass capabilities; " The bass delivered by ATC is more than ever a reflection of what's on the record". It goes on and on; "scarily large yet controlled slabs of double bass. This is a phenomenally revealing and capable speaker, and in terms of transparency to detail, energy, timing and bandwidth it has few peers".

This reviewer is not alone in thinking ATC makes the best speakers in the world. If you prefer reading check out some of the users for their home systems - jools holland etc. Maybe some of you have a different idea to most, but I wouldn't go shouting it from the tree tops.
 
merlin said:
AK, I guess you failed to read my post correctly.

As for the rest, I am beginning to think that the majority of people on these forums wouldn't be able to tell colouration (or the lack of it) from their elbows. Bub baiting is both boring and so last year!
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Maybe I didn't read your post correctly, and for that I appologise, as for the rest of your response, I'm begining to think you are extremely arrogant, why should your opinion be more valid than anyone elses, IIRC when you listened to these speakers, they were out of phase, and as such, haven't heard them in fine fettle, I also never mentioned any colouration, i said they were dull, loud yes, but dull, all the sounds were the same, no definition at all, Have you compared these back to back with others?, I did this just a couple of wees ago, and IMHO (which, no matter what you think, is just as valid as yours)the hyperion 938 slaughtered them, have you heard this loudspeaker? FWIW I wouldn't have either, but the hyperions with an air integrated were so much more enjoyable.

And as for your snide comment at the end, I am not baiting anyone, like everyone else on here I am entitled to my opinion, I could have responded to any number of Bub's posts, but haven't felt the need, as afterall he's allowed to express his opinion too, I can't speak for the others, maybe that is their honest opinion, but i also seem to remember a lot of your posts baiting bub and everyone else who took your fancy, Lowrider (sonus faber) Michaleab(sceptisism)so you are being a might hypocritical, wouldn't you agree, you often accuse people of things like this, when you too are guilty of the same, it's not funny and it's not clever.
 
Hi,

pauldixonuk said:
We have not heard a response from 3D, detailing the exact system in which the atc's 'failed'.
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I have heard them in several studios (various), also in a variety of dealer situations and at demo's. Their failings are the same as common to speakers that share their fundamental technology, poor pattern control confuscate imaging and tonality, notable levels of compression tend to impose themselves, which I hate in speakers (I am aware that high compression levels are considered by many as giving "good dynamics" when in reality they merely make things sound louder).

In the end the result was in all cases that Speakers and Room interposed themselves between the music & myself considerably more than I can tolerate for either "music for pleasure" or "monitoring". We may argue the internal electronics are at fault, the tweeters or the woofers, the directivity pattern and magnet design and so on, untill the cows come home, with little resloution.

The design of the speakers is one that will cause certain behaviours which it shares with many others and which preclude any significant of accuracy in acoustically small rooms and other parts of the implementation limit the freedom from distortion and compression to a rather larger degree than permissable for a quality monitor.

Compared to generic HiFi speakers the ATC's will play louder without strain and with the bigger ones the soft dome midrange makes them perpetually inoffensive which make sense in commercial monitoring envoironments and I guess next to the toys t6hat normally pass for "HiFi Speakers" in Britain (eg the LS3/5) they do non too bad. But in absolute terms they suffer many designed in fundamental limitations.

Ciao T
 

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