Technics SL1200/1210 debate

I don't know. I am told that the new one is "better", but that is the way of the world, isn't it? These things are never quantified. It's hardly going to be described as a downgrade.

 

http://www.soundhifi.com/sl1200/index.htm

Belt drives suffer from 'belt flutter' whether they use AC or DC motors, there isn't much you can do about it. However with a direct drive, you can alter all the characteristics by simply changing the loop filter. This modification reduces the phase comparator loop filter gain and moves the turn-over point, thereby totally eliminating the low frequency instability. To be honest, the effect isn't as dramatic as our 'zoomed in' scope shows, but it is very worthwhile. This modification gives über pure bass, if you thought the SL-1200 had a handle on bass, and it does, then this will blow your socks off! No good for DJ's, but wonderful news for audiophiles!

 

Hifi World reviewed the SL1210/Timestep/SMEV/Koetsu but didn't (apparently) measure the contribution of any of the modifications or of the standard SL1210.

Martin Colloms claims to have measured differences in felt mats for the LP12 and "vibration and micro flutter variations of different motors." in the context of the Radikal. Due in the next 'Hifi Critic'.

Paul

 

This sounds like the start of a proper forum project.

Paul

 

So it would seem.

So when exactly are subjective appraisals acceptable?

 

That'll make for an interesting read. I wonder if Martin would be able to measure the 'very, very large difference' he'd experience in changing to a Model 20?

 

Well, as pointed out many pages ago, the subjective appraisals of the upgraded Technics are at variance. The "Scalford Two" describe it as a "giant-killer", while someone else in the thread said it was "OK, but no giant-killer", and the many blinkered idiots with agendas who attended the show seemed largely unmoved by it.

So, who to believe?

 

James, don't be lazy, don't trust the opinion of anyone else at all and find out for yourself.

 

Who said that about one of these modified 1210's? I must've missed that.

 

I have spoken to Timestep, and not suprisingly he is a little cautious of posting on here.

Unfortunately the thread has become somewhat de-railed and lacks objective discussion - I don't think anyone would disagree.

If anyone wants any specific measurement taken on a Timestep PSU I can email him and ask if he can provide the results.

Hopefully that would finish this, which has become rather silly IMO.

 

Guy, I think it was SCIDB.

 

Hi,

Let me clarify. I have used a standard Technics many times. I have had them in my system. I didn't find it better than what I was using. (Townshend turnables at the time)

I have heard a modded Technics. It had different feet and a Michell Tecno arm and a different mat. It didn't have the timestep power supply.

It was at a bake off and not in my own system.

SCIDB

 

James, actually nobody who has heard a modded 1210 has said said 'ok, but no giant killer' not in this thread anyway.

It must have been your imagination!

 

No, I didn't imagine it. In fact, I quoted it.

 

The interesting Timestep SL1210 mod is the 'motor dynamics mod'. The PSU is just a PSU, I reckon we could evaluate the effects on the SL1210 with any number of DC supplies, the DIY world is not short of these. A tweaked Naim SNAPS (or equivalent) would probably do...

Paul

 

Edit: D Louth 77: Given your history on this forum, I can't help thinking the personal comments aren't the wisest thing in the world for you to be posting...? - Mark

 

did any one of you ever had the first sl 1200 specially desing for the sme 3009? and can you define the real difference between 1200/1210 apart from.....colour? was it based on the original sl120mk11, the original d/d was first vetured by luxman but shelfed,then matsushita went foward to complete the d/d system on the turntables, however the correction of the introduction of moving coil carts created a problem in the magnetic field between t/t/ and cartridge, then luxman made a t/t to accomulate two tone arms on one t/t to rectyfie the d/d interfirenc of m.fields and corrrect the problem, never got reed of "beat"problems, ole!
nando.

 

According to the Sound Hi-fi site it was just colour.

 

quote

correct.
nando

 

Hi Paul

We could try that if you're game?

I dont have the turntable or a snaps etc - so can be of little benefit. Do we have the equipment between us? Sounds like Dean has a 1210, and the mods are surely reversable?

Unfortunately the chap behind Timestep doesnt want involvement, due to a perceived negativity on the thread. It's a shame but I do understand his feelings.