What do you believe in ?

I thought that Yorkist was a chocolate bar ... and you were from Telford.

I'll step up to the plate (or into the stockades).

I don't believe that the chakras are linked to a specific system or organ of the body. I look upon them as a construct which can aid understanding for those on the spiritual paths dealing with the moving of Kundalini energy.

My own biofeedback and meditation teacher, the late C. Maxwell Cade, was of the view that all forms of meditation, spiritual growth and even many therapies, deal with the movement of Kundalini energy, whether they know it or not. One of the books he liked was an obscure work by Lee Sannella MD called "Kundalini - Transcendance or Psychosis", in which he argued that some of what is now described as psychosis would be labelled in a different culture or time as symptoms of the shake up due to spiritual growth.

I dare say that everything I've said so far is more likely to confuse than enlighten. Nevertheless, I shall plough on regardless...

I teach Ki Aikido (as you may recall) a martial art which deals with the coordination of mind and body. 'Ki' is the Japanese term meaning 'life energy' ('Chi' or 'Qi' in Chinese). I do not, however, believe that this is an energy in the physical sense and don't even think it matters whether it exists or not. As with Kundalini, it's a construct that can help understanding.

Look at it this way, I could tell you that a sense of positivity, or that you 'can do' something, has a positive effect on the body and what you can achieve physically - and you might believe it, particularly if I could give you a clear physical demonstration then and there. For the sake of shorthand and as a teaching method, I sometime refer to this as feeling 'life energy'. If I wanted you to 'extend your mind' through your fingertips and beyond, in the execution of a specific technique or exercise, I might ask you to hold your arm in a relaxed way and act as if energy is flowing through beyond the fingertips, like water through a hosepipe. Whether or not the energy actually exists is of little concern to me. What works, works.

Similarly in 'hands-on' healing, I don't care whether a healer is a member of an organisation that believes that they are channelling the healing power of someone long-dead. Nor do I care whether they believe that they are acting as an instrument of God or Christ. It doesn't matter to me whether the healing arises purely from a parent's love for their child. I am only concerned with what passes between healer and 'healee' in their interaction. I don't believe that there is necessarily any exchange of physical or electromagnetic energy taking place. However, the interaction proceeds as if there was an energy exchange. Therefore, when I'm practising or teaching 'healing', I do so on that basis. It makes things easier.

So does that explain at least my position on these 'energies'. No, I didn't think so. It would be easier to discuss these matters directly, 'hands-on' so to speak.

 

Excellent post, I must admit to having great difficulty in getting over, ideas and theories in a language that can be understood by those without a truly open mind. It appears that many people choose only to believe the things that re enforce their own views. To those with a basic understanding of alternative therapies your post will make much sense, to many others it will remain mumbo jumbo.

I am trying to locate some information about another therapy I trained in, SHEN. This was developed by Richard Pavek an American scientist; he developed a therapy based upon the release of trapped emotions from within the body. He theorised that a great many diseases were caused by these same trapped emotions. His therapy was based around various emotional centres within the body that related to particular emotions. The basic theory made much sense to me, what I particularly liked was the therapy did not require any verbal input from therapist or client, other than an initial interview. It was not necessary to have any understanding or insight into your problem, merely the wish to be rid of it. He produced a lot of data related to the energy flows generated during a session and I believe was able to measure this.

His therapy was later changed, introducing a counselling slant, I then decided to go my own way. Shen has many similarities with many other therapies, the emotional centres were in fact the Chakras, a point lost on Mr Pavek. He was rather of the opinion that as only Shen was based in science, then all the others were just hot air.

 

Just like an Englishman in new york, Im a Yorkshireman in Telford - Sting just couldnt get it to rhyme

Hope you dont mean your Aikido expertise - you'll kick my ass

Would you agree that in the unlikely event that any 'energy' is used (I say that in the physical sense of the word), that the healing processes you use are encouraging a finely tuned and highly targeted strong sense of belief?

I'm not talking about placebo effect, Im thinking the mind is a powerful thing and can effect us physicaly (for good and bad).

'Self belief' probably does work - 'spiritual meditation', is much more unlikely to work, unless it is another form of self belief.

No doubt that people who practice this (and other similar methods) are very focussed, strong, good people in many many ways - I'm not looking to deride - but at the end of the day the vehicles used (including the chakra wheels) are mumbo jumbo. That is unless there is scientific proof otherwise? Dont forget energy can be measured - So if these spiritual energies exist, what are they? Or is it the 'mind effect' mentioned earlier, that has been misinterpreted over the many thousands of years and cultures have used mumbo jumbo to try and understand/explain it?

 

I am willing to be proven wrong, you are not willing to accept the fact you might be wrong.

 

I had an ex who was into all things alternative, including some of the ideas mentioned here. This was quite entertaining to begin with, especially in the bedroom. However she turned out to be completely mad. Admittedly this does tend to colour my opinion of others with alternative new-agey beliefs.

 

Yes certainly, but I'm convinced that there's something else going on in addition.

I'm sure that these spiritual energies cannot be measured but perhaps their effects can. As I said before I'm not convinced of their actual physical existence but believe they provide a framework for working and understanding.

No I'd meet you as my alter-ego - mild-mannered speaker designer and forum contributor.

 

By day, mild mannered speaker designer.....reminds me of hong kong phooey

If something doesnt exist that actually helps people - great!

 

Not true, I am happy to be proven wrong, you may find this difficult though, as I have practiced Healing and Dousing, and know that they work, how can you prove to me they do not ?
On the other hand if you tried a little experiment yourself, you could prove that something is indeed happening.

With very little practice most people can feel another persons Aura and also the Chakras, this energy is the life force, Qi or whatever you wish to call it.

 

Not in my case, but possible for the recipient. I still have difficulty accepting, that by my placing of hands on or around a person, I can feel energies flow from my right hand through the client and into my left hand. This flow can also be experienced by the client. As stated before, I don't believe there is any necessity for the client to have any belief in what I am doing, to gain any benefit .

In what way is it unlikley to work ?

Well you've got me on that one. I am unable to explain in scientific language what the energy is, or why it can't be measured, Not that I have tried. I am still looking for the info on Shen, as I believe that some measurements were made by Richard Pavek.
If some one has chronic shoulder pain for over two years, and visits the doctor, physiotherapists, osteopaths and chiropractor without any reduction in symptoms, but after a single healing session makes a complete recovery, does this not constitute proof ?

 

If some one has chronic shoulder pain for over two years, and visits the doctor, physiotherapists, osteopaths and chiropractor without any reduction in symptoms, but after a single healing session makes a complete recovery, does this not constitute proof ?

NO!!!!!

 

erm....cause it doesnt exist?

Shen? Shen? Hands on release for unlocking emotions to cure physical ills? Yeah right. Regardless of all the discussions prior, this is venturing into fantasy bollox.

Please, please convince me otherwise//lamb

 

Don't hold your breath!

 

I remember seeing an expose of healers on the BBC3 series 'The Bullshit Detective'. The healers claimed to be able to cure cancer and other serious illness (while under covert filming). Sick in the head, should be locked up.

 

Yep and all these alternative medicine pratts soon line up for an op if they become seriously ill.

 

There are healers and healers. None of those healers who contribute to this forum have made such a claim and nor would the vast majority of healers generally. However, you can trust a television documentary entitled "The Bullshit Detective" to find a few exceptions.

Yes, and there are brain surgeons who take paracetamol for a headache.

 

Obviously many natural chemical compounds are used in 'Western' medicine but they're proven through rigorous scientific testing methods.

I think that's the point.

 

Not possible on the forum, if you really want to find out, look for a Shen practitioner in your area and book some sessions. I believe it would be a life changing experience for you !

 

Another constructive post bob, thanks

 

It never ceases to amaze me that people can hold such vitriolic views about subjects that they have not even bothered to look into themselves, and yet display such crass naivety if the information they gather form the internet and the television fits their argument.