Windbag is worse threat than Terrorists..

No-one is tarring you, Kenny. You are giving a good impression of a selfish, petulant oaf, however.

 

the rise in gun crime since handguns was outlawed is one reason why I believe he is incorrect.

I would have thought that you would have grasped that the solution is to treat the cause rather than the symptom.

Yes, increasing price will reduce comsumption, but I put it to you again that it is not the solution to the problem

the fact that people with access to far cheaper alcohol seem to manage without the same problems seems to speak volumes.

of the 50% of your patients you claim as direct alcohol related, please give me an idea of how many brew their own.

 

it's selfish to behave responsibly?

why the need to throw your toys by resorting to insults?

 

I don't know how many brew their own, it's irrelevant. What's relevant is that the amount consumed needs to fall, and I'm glad that you finally concede that increasing the price will achieve that.

 

Resorting to insults:

 

where are the mods when you need them..?

this thread's is going nowhere...may as well close it...sigh...

 

What is the point of posting that? You decide whether a thread is 'going nowhere', do you?

 

nope...but your post does indeed confirm where it's going...

 

Well one mod's opinion is that Bub has a point. He is after all, as he pointed out, a liver specialist and sees the problem first hand. Which is more than can be said for most of us. As for the name calling, both parties are equally guilty IMO and whilst it does breach the guidelines, let hope it doesn't get worse. If it does, then posts will be deleted and/or thread locked.

Let's keep it friendly guys.

 

This is the crux of the problem. Too many people don't know when to stop. Too much bother is caused. If affects many aspects in society.

As the Devil has pointed out, alot of hassle and cost in the health service is due to drink and drink related problems.

As I have pointed out & also PeteH, who are these irresponsible people few? One reason why it is not easy is the nature and effect of alcohol. It is a depressant. This affect the nervous system which results in slowing of responses, reaction, thinking, movement etc.

The effects vary from person to person but increase with more alcohol. This can lead, in the short term, to agressive behaviour, mood swings, violence, arguments, anxienty plus load of other things.

Anyone potentially can suffer this and people from all walks of life do.

I have seen and experienced alcohol related crime or incident. I have been a victim of it. I can tell it is not all done by so called "chavs".


SCIDB

 

I dont deny that there are a lot of people no doubt coming to you with alcohol related illnesses. Are they all young'uns though? Or are a lot of them fat, sweaty alcoholics who actually dont bother anyone else except for themselves? I suspect an equal measure, but I mainly suspect that its the young'uns who arent ill, but actually end up in A&E...

And as for louts, well, they often say drink brings out the true person inside... so if they are louts when drunk, then they would likely be louts if they had no access to, or be able to afford, drink. Maybe they'd go and mug an old granny for a £7 pint of beer...

 

I don't think so. People will always drink, but it's the amount which matters.

I have one patient at present who has been in my ward - occupying an acute medical bed - for FIVE MONTHS. The reason for his long stay is that he is homeless, and social services are trying to 'place' him into institutional care. He is by no means atypical.

 

I'd say that if you want to reduce binge drinking, then increasing the prices at late night drinking establishments would go a long way towards that.

People drink irresponsibly at home (or on the streets in some cases) sure - but I feel attacking it at a late night social/cultural level will cause greatest effect.

When I take my holidays in Europe, its always a pleasant suprise to find more people drinking coffee in late night cafes, eating meals and having a relaxed pleasant time with a bottle of wine.

Again, I think we need to attack binge drinking as a cultural societal event. I cant think of any way of doing that other than price.

how about just making drinks expensive in pubs and clubs after 6pm on Fridays/Sat/Sunday nights?

 

Alcoholism is an illness. It can not cured by putting up the prices or banging up people in prisons. If the victim can not afford to buy alcohol, he/she will turn to meths or illicit produce that can be poisonous.

 

Good idea.

BTW an acute medical bed costs the taxpayer about £500 per day in "hotel" costs alone - without factoring in nursing & medical care, nor medication. We are all paying for that.

 

I am aware of that. Even more reason to bump up the price as a preventative measure.

 

I take it some of you lot were never young then.... actually you probably were.... and a lot of you probably did this yourself when you were young, but you've had your fun, so sod the rest of us eh?

I am all for harsher punishment for causing trouble, but you lot are tarring everyone who likes a friday night drink with the same brush....

 

Devil,
As the only one in this thread in the trade, how would the health service be affected by an increase in illegal drug users?

I'm not suggesting that would happen if alcohol prices went up, just interested to hear the relative impact of drink and drugs.

 

The impact of illicit drug use upon the NHS is currently minuscule compared with alcohol.

If there was an increase in their use, then that might increase, but there's no evidence to suggest that pushing up the price of alcohol would lead to any increase in illicit drugs.

 

Just like theres no evidence to suggest if they put the price up, they'll drink less. People will buy their drink from supermarkets and smuggle it into bars instead.